Funny how you nitpick on small details that don't really mean the point where I was trying to get. Clapping can be used to make an arrangement, and that isn't an instrument, but I was not restricting my point to saying musical instruments as in piano, guitar, etc but any resource you use to producing a sound, be it a piano or a cricket orchestra, since you're into animal music. Also, chill out a little, I mean, no need to losing the temper over the internet :yes


huh? Producing in the way I'm mentioning is the process of making music. Maybe I used the wrong terms, but hey, I'm not writing a formal letter to a big authority here. I was obviously not referring to the other rest of production, like organizing release dates, CD manufacturing, planning on covers and video clips and advertisement and everything else. I was talking about the basic production of making a song as a whole, so let's not be taking this conversation another whole level.

Again, you're repeating yourself over to which I already told that I know she doesn't arrange or compose most of her songs. But for the lyrics to fit, some alterations to the original backing track might be needed as well as she need to work closely with the composition in order for her lyrics to fit, meaning she's amking the song as well. And, yes, anyone can write lyrics, anyone can play a piano arrangement and anyone can make a composition - however whether those will have quality is what I'm trying to imply, and that demands work, inspiration, creativity and time wasted. So if you're working to make things flow well together, be it lyrics, composition or arrangement, you are in the process of making/ producing a song.

She has composed a few songs, anyway. I won't be wasting time to repeat the rest though.

Funny, how you were saying that ANYONE can do that, and your example of anyone making lyrics to put into a song is actually...ayu, which was actually the opposite point you were trying to justify. ayu can connect her lyrics with songs, even to pre-existing ones, but she needs to closely work what she'll be writing along with the composition, so she does play an important part on how the arrangements, compositions and lyrics will build together to become a song, which has been my point all over. It's pretty easy to say: "anyone can do that!". That way I can go to youtube and look for "brain tumor excision", see the neurosurgeon cutting here and there and say: oh anyone can operate a brian tumor, just cut here and there. It's pretty simple to say you can do something. The process of doing it is another story.

I just won't be wasting my time on discussing this anymore, though.

oh wait...idk I could be wrong lol I think there are a few exceptions...:laugh

and to be on topic too i'm just going to say my god I am agreeing with all of your posts here in this thread. I'm also agreeing with what Impactbreaker is saying. :yes

I like her recent Ballads, I'm hoping she will release a up-beat song soon but I'm happy with the recent stuff :yes

Glad we agree, baby! ;D

I think you're forgetting all of the composing she did for her earlier albums. :/ She is a pop idol, but that's not all she is. She is not lazy or nonchalant with her music, and she is a big part of her sound- accept it and move on because no one is reading your repetitive 5,000 word posts anymore.

No, from the top of my head, I know she didn't write the lyrics for ECSTASY and JUICY, but she does write or co-write a lot.

lol guys, I don't agree with hseinko...but I think you put a little too much stock into her "composing".

But that's all I'm going to say about it lol


and ah I knew there were some she didn't write lyrics too. I dont think she did cherry girl either...but I could be wrong about that too lol

she was humming a tune to a casette recorder. she has no formal training in music at all. can she even read notes?

I'm sorry you're not into Ayu's "new" sound OP but a break is always good, even I need them from my favorite artists. :D

Kuu wrote the lyrics for Cherry Girl actually...

^^ She learned to play Piano, no? She'd have to learn how to read music for that I'm sure. Even if she has no formal training, she does have musical experience. She'd be pretty dense if she learned nothing all these years.

I accept the fact that her music styles do change, but there's always space to improve. There's always some who really like her music style atm, but some who don't (and some who are in the middle).

And to be fair, Ayu is really working her socks off lately and trying to do her best. It's just a matter of taste really.

LOL @ what this thread became in less than twelve hours. :roflmao


Well for me, some of the earliest stuff I listened to was the entire Memorial Address album, kiss o kill, vogue, Fly high, M, Pride, Mirrorcle World, INSPIRE, and GAME. So it was mix of things from different eras and for the most part, I still love these songs, a few I wouldn't rank among her absolute best but they're great songs nonetheless. Listening to her albums were done in a similar random method, Memorial Address was the first, MY STORY second then NL, GUILTY, RAINBOW, Secret, (m)u, I am..., Duty, LA with ASFXX being the last one after RnRC. MA was a favorite right off the bat though were were a few songs I didn't much care for but now I pretty much love everything about the album, lol. I loved NL too, and it's still a favorite. m(u) was another instant favorite though the randomness of the genres confused the hell out of me. I thought RAINBOW was an absolute bore at first listen but I decided to give it a another chance and fell in love with it. From reading reviews online, MS, Duty, and I am... were often praised so I went in listening to those albums with high expectations and was pretty let down. The awesomeness of Duty came through after a few more listens and MY STORY eventually won me over but I still can only listen to first half of I am... minus evolution + M. :laugh GUILTY and RnRC are pretty much at the bottom of Ayu albums chart while NEXT LEVEL is close to the top. But if I were to compile of list of what I felt were her best songs, most of them would probably be from post-MY STORY and only two of them post-Secret.

I wouldn't can't say there was a "blue" period for me because well... I've only been on the Ayu bandwagon for two years. That would be really silly. :laugh But as I said before, I just find I prefer some of the older stuff in her discography more. Putting it in chronological order, for me, it was easy to hear and see the changes in her style and music so it's kinda interesting when people who've been around longer than I have and experienced the changes as they were happening in real time feel like nothing's changed at all.

And all this is exactly why I find the "nostalgia" arguments to be absolute bull****. :P

WOW! hsienko is the very first person on AHS that wrote exactly what I've been trying to explain back then.

I have been always wondering why everyone says, Ayu writes her own lyrics and stuff. She doesn't even plays an instrument nor does she writes lyrics by her own except of the few CREA songs. She basically has to give Avex's music a face / an image. I am OK with that!

Thanks for that great post, hsienko!

Uh... she writes the lyrics for all of her songs, ever since ASFXX.

And hey.. Kyo from Dir en grey has no musical knowledge or training and he's composed songs for the band, and for his own "solo" works for his poem book releases. Huh. Is he not a musician?

My god, some of you are just sad.

Nor does Michael Jackson or John Lennon/Paul McCartney. They can play instruments, but they never learned how to read sheet music. It's not necessary.

CREA songs: Ayu wrote both lyrics and melody
all of her other songs but Love: Since 1999: Ayu wrote the lyrics

Ayu is credited as the writter of all of her lyrics but the one written by Tsunku... Maybe u are just misstaking her role as CREA, where she composed the melody too...

Ok took a me a while before i realized the existence of this thread and Page 5 & 6 was when things started getting a little off..but regardless, lemme quote a few members stuff and also add on to them.

But one thing I have to say, EVERY FAN will come to a point when YOUR music style subtly changes with the influence around you (because there are just TONS of catch-ier tracks out there released on the market..like do you see MANY western artistes using BALLADS as promotional tracks? no. Hence, fans are spoilt these days). And besides your style changing, Ayu will NEVER be the same. For the better or for the worst (to each his own). With new producers and arrangers, you just can't expect the same thing.
And see how Utada, Kuu, Namie, Mika have all changed after 2-3 albums carrying the same style and compared to them, Ayu has been more consistent with her own style of rock/pop. AND of course, there are special occasions where she creatse a different sound like Sparkle. Yet isnt Sparkle something so common in today's music? Its just because Ayu released it and that is something new for her AND it FITS IN with today's audience.

+1 to the club. I'm a post-MY STORY fan. So for me, I dun really that big a change in style except that, nowadays, she hardly makes 2-3 rock songs together. I mean back then, opening the album with About You & GAME, I was WOW-ed. Of course, Microphone is her most recent epic. Definitely looking forward to her new album.

Yup, i agree. i mentioned above, compared to other singers, Ayu has been more consistent in keeping that similar genres but now it sort of becomes either a hit or miss. Ayu doesn't make music that follows the trend, among POP singers..and esp Jpop singers.

Well. then we should all give her songs time. Being a more recent fan, i would say, when I heard her older songs (which were all new to me in 2004 lol), they were as magical as her MY STORY album, cept that I think for MY STORY, she had this stronger sound for me. There was a slew of ballads in MY STORY and it WORKED.

yes those three are MEANT to secure the streak. And yes, somehow, no matter how strange the song, there's always something special that makes us know that it belongs in Ayu's discography. For me, I have a BESTOFAYU tracklist in my iPod and songs like Sparkle and SLT, which sounds nothing like songs released before them, are also in there. Not just because it's good but somehow, with the addition of these songs, if you look at her discography AS A WHOLE, it feels all-rounded. If it was back in 2002, an Ayu playlist, for me, would not feel as complete.


With all that, Let me end off by saying, i too, have been guilty of paying less attention to Ayu's songs as the months go by, unless she releases new material, then I would have an Ayu-craze period (As with all other artistes actually). Ayu now, serves as an artiste that reminds me how trends are not followed admist all the digital sound. She doesnt give me dance tracks after dance tracks but instead, a more raw and down-to-earth sound.

She wrote SHAKE IT ;) All by herself.

Not really losing my temper since I was being stupid and it was a joke.




Neither will I since your clumsy counter argument is always flipping side. First you say she has everything to do with the composing and arrange music works closely with the composer and arranger when she writes the lyrics and then you say her involvement is minimal because she just writes lyrics and then afterwards may ask for a note change her or there.

This shouldn't have even been anything, all I said was that she writes lyrics and then outsources the actual production of music which everyone knows is fact and a lot of singers do it.

Okay, I'm not going to read all 6 pages, got through three and I really want to post my thoughts. So, if this idea has been presented before I apologize.

In the early 1990's, heralded by Kurt Cobain came a brand new style of music that swept the nation and still has a rabid fan base today. All of us Americans know what it is, some call it "Grunge" but it's more than that, it was the birth of "Alternative" music, it wasn't rock, it wasn't pop, it wasn't jazz... it was something else and it was good. From that found era of the late 1980s and early 1990s many many many amazing bands have created some godly music, from Nirvana, to Alice In Chains... Love them both. Problem is? Their lead singers are both very very dead. But one group that was in that circle some how managed, even after losing a founding member and a lawsuit against their label, to stay together even now. From their first EP in 1992 to their last album in 2006, the band is currently recording their 6th studio album. This band is Tool. I have loved TOOL and been an avid fan since 1996, right before their release of their first #1 album Ænima. This group cannot be defined by genre. If you have listened to all their music you can pin down certain songs that fit into a specific genre, but not the band and their music as a whole. They try strange, melodic songs that capture your entire psyche, and on the same hand give you a song screaming into the mic with hard drums and wailing guitar. I am still a die hard fan eagerly awaiting their next album.

I only speak of this because Ayu is the same way. I've been a fan of Ayu since 2001 when I first heard "Dearest", then bought "UNITE!" and then my friend bought "I Am..." for me. There was no turning back. She hasn't been around as long as TOOL, but she has released WAY more music than them. It is my firm feeling that some songs you're not going to like, you just don't. There are some TOOL songs I just don't like, I always skip "Ticks and Leeches" and "Rosetta Stoned", in fact MOST of their 5th albums I do not listen to the majority of the tracks. But the tracks I do listen to, are so amazing, that I can almost feel like a spirituality coming from them. It's crazy I know. Anyway, TOOL can't be classified into a genre, while people call Ayu the "Queen of JPoP", she's not. She's strayed so far from "Jpop" that the only way you can call her a Jpop artist is that she Japanese and has some pop songs. She's extremely eclectic. I actually feel like Guilty was great, but safe, while Next Level and RnRc were not. Even these single, to me, seem risky. The only "safe" songs in her last three have been, IMO, "Blossom" and "Sweet Seasons". Other than that, she's trying out different sounds. I ADORE "Moon" I LOVE that song. The lyrics, the melody, I find it an amazing piece that is a mix between a rock ballad and a soft love song. I think "crossroad" was brilliant. I've NEVER heard Ayu do such an outright western style folk song. That took real guts, and with those amazing lyrics, the chords... it's a gorgeous piece of music if you appreciate the western (American) folk over tones. I REALLY respect Ayu's balls for covering TMR's "Seven Days [of] War". The lyrics suit Ayu perfectly, NONE of her two other covers did. This is a real, quality cover that Ayu does complete justice. Her vocals have matured and I can hear that she's getting some coaching and is learning how to work with her maturing vocals on vocal intensive songs. "Seven Days War" is a PERFECT example of her this guttural power she's found in her voice. It's not volume, it's power. You can hear it in "Moon" too; the soft build up to the chorus that just explodes, and it's not the music, if you listen to the pure vocal track, it's her. While I don't much care for "Virgin Road" lyrics, the chorus is an utterly gorgeous melody, and she does have some great lines. But this is a REALLY different type of Ballad for her - there's a formula, but no her normal ballad formula. I don't like the melody of the verses, but the chorus totally makes up for it. And "Last Angel" took me back to My Story & Memorial Address. The lyrics also reflect how she's starting, maybe, to use more mature lyrics. It also perfectly melds rock and pop with electronica, which can be horribly done. Lady Gaga can't even do it right yet. But "Last Angel" has that meld perfect.

So while some of her song are really mreh, it's about looking beyond and realize that it may sounds dull or safe to YOU, but for her, it is a risk. I really believe "Crossroad" as a headlining song, was a huge risk for single promotion. I've weeded out the Ayu songs I have no taste for, but I've found so much beauty in her recent work because I KNOW about American Folk music, I know about electronica, and I can hear the different genres she's merging into one cohesive song. It's actually a very difficult process. My brother is a professional audio engineer, he always babbles this stuff to me ^^;

I hope you guys understood my point!

^ That's a very interesting post on TOOL & the three new singles.

People tend to change with time. It's not like Ayu doesn't make amazing songs anymore, it's more like you just don't love what she makes anymore. I think that is pretty natural. You can't force yourself to love what she's doing right now.

Although I'm a complete fanboy for Ayu, I don't love everything she releases. In fact, I dislike most of her electronic/rock songs with some exceptions (Rule, Evolution, Naturally etc.). But that has not stop me from loving her as a whole. I still find her new singles amazing like Virgin Road and Crossroads. And also, her old music is always there, it's not going anywhere.

It's funny because threads like this one have been around since always (the question has been in people's minds since ayu started)

So I don't know. Too many bricks with opinions to read? I don't have the time I'm sorry :(


Some people can handle change, ups & downs better than others... I guess that's why some of us can be happy with whatever she puts out and others just hate it all. Oh well :)

I agree with most of ur points, but just some information^^

In Japan, jpop is not really a music genre... it just mean it's western influenced popular music in general... Actually, one of the reasons why they tend to make such diverse mixes between genres, is that they don't really see the differences among them... it's like... tradicional music, western influenced music and international music...

And about Ayu being the queen of jpop... It's not also something only music oriented, but her role as a pop icon in Japan modern culture... Taking Madonna as a comparation, Most of her albums can't really be classified as pop music, even some of her most successful like Ray of Light and Music, still, her (and Ayu) have both a pop culture influence archieved when they where producing pop that make most of their non-pop production to have this kind of impact AND the power and influence to take experiemental stuff to the mainstream and make them get well known...

I got into Ayu in my mid teens, a time in my life that was quite hectic, with lots of personal physical and emotional difficulties. Ayu at that point was what kept me on track, able to cheer me up out of my darkest times.

Naturally, these days when I'm not feeling so great I'll revisit her pre-MS works and that wave of happy nostalgia helps more than anything. The older songs are something I've become so familiar with that my emotional attachment to them makes them feel different to her more recent works.

Of course I still love almost all her songs but I usually only OMGLURVE 3-4 songs per album lately...

Sometimes I wish Ayu would release another MS or I Am... but then I wonder how I'd feel about her simply recycling near-decade old songs and arrangements simply so I could feel good about the music I listen to. It feels awfully selfish to me, as I already have the real MS and I Am... right here. :P Honestly, if Ayu went back and made "new" old albums I'd feel cheated because she's rehashing her old work so much...

Honestly I don't know how to feel about Ayu's new music. It's awfully conflicting. Of course I wish she'd lay off the ballads and experiment more (the upbeat tracks of RnRC were all amazing and a sign the experimental Ayu is not going away anytime soon, she's just hibernating lol) but I have other artists I like. I listen to them as well, not just Ayu.

Go listen to other artists. Ask for suggestions on who to follow. Try listening to other foreign language artists and come back to Ayu with fresh ears. If you are able to give her new music a shot, be happy that you've gotten over your slump. If you still don't like her style, you've still got, what, 120+ amazing songs from the eras you loved best? Most western artists I've listened to are lucky if I like more than 5 songs from! ;)

Don't panic, don't get down and give it some time...that's the real advice I have for you.

new style? I think she going back to an old style of music she played in her ASFXX-LOVEppears era firing her staff and collaborating with her old composers

When I was sick of Ayu I was sick of Ayu, it was my problem, not hers, so I would listen to someone else for few weeks and I missed Ayu and I got back to her and... since then Im obsessed with her music.
Her latest singles are perfect imho. Go listen to someone else.

People's definition of a musician seems blurry.

First you don't need to do all that to be called a musician. Heck I played the violin (badly) and people called me a musician.

I'm gonna quote the wikipedia article again

You don't need to do ALL THOSE to be considered as a musician. Thank you.

Andrenekoi: The point about what her being the "queen of Jpop " wasn't the literal interpretation. You're playing on semantics, and I was just making a broad point.

She's fired staff? Who'd she dump?

Ugh this thread was getting just nothing but irritating until Nessa came in.

Thank you, nessa.

Ayu is more than her songs. If you don't like a few of her songs, you can still like her. Ayu has plenty of songs I dislike (some, like Sweet Season, I seem to have an inexplicably vehement hatred for), but the fact that she did them is kind of awesome, and I adore that about her.

I don't think her music style has really changed much from what she has been doing since Memorial Address, sure she would occasionally try out something new or dive into a new genre, but the signature Ayu feel to her music is still there.

If someone dislikes her newer songs, maybe you've just got tired, it happens and instead of *****ing about it, maybe you should just stay away from AHS (or the Ayu threads), stop following her for a while and find other artists/musicians you like.

You are so not alone here. I feel exactly the same as you. :)

Some people don't understand that concept. :shrug

No, but I agree, imo, her music has changed. I mean, she didn't take a swerve in a completely new direction obviously. The reason I'm not enjoying a lot of her new songs is that they aren't memorable to me like they were before.

Ayu needs to release a CREA-composed song that's sonically a cross between Lady Gaga and Beethoven and Vince Guaraldi and Taylor Swift and whose music video has a super-super deep storyline with lots of symbolism and avant-garde imagery and flying mutant laser-shooting zebras. It would add a, ah, new dimension to these threads, no?

Some really aren't, but because she is Ayu, I give those songs another chance and eventually grow to like them.

I have that too

I didn't like some of the album tracks in Rock'n'Roll Circus , like meaning of Love

I guess after hearing the Acoustic Piano take of it , my views towards the song has changed somewhat after a while

Anyway , nobody's asking so & so to like everything that ayumi released . I don't like all of her songs in her discography but I still follow her & it has already happened for the last 4 years since I 1st made the decision to listen to jpop

honestly, there's always people complaining that they don't like Ayu's " most recent" music. i've been around here since 2004 and after each album gets released, people always talk about the past releases. you're gonna like or dislike certain eras. you connect with what Ayu's currently doing or you don't.

^ Exactly. We all get disconnect from time to time and there are times I am not as hyped about the new releases, but I always download/pre-order them right away, regardless. Though that usually depends on how busy I am. Still if you don't like something, it's not the end of the world, we grow and change a little bit every day.

THIS!
I agree with everything you said! :heart

Ayu's music is unique and different. She dares to try new things and doesn't care if people like it or not. She lives her music and puts all her heart into writing her lyrics and singing her songs. Her music is "true music"...unlike a lot of other "music" nowadays.

<3

Best post of the thread :heart

I TOTALLY AGREE with you!!! I love her albums before Guilty, don't get me wrong, I love Guilty but it's just not as striking as Secret, (M)U or My Story. Next Level is bland, and i totally hate Rock N Roll Circus era, i don't like the songs and just can't stand the PVs of this era, it's like Ayu ran out of creativity but i still buy the CD because i love Ayu and i wanna support her.
But i love the L single, especially Virgin Road because it's unpredictable. I love Ayu with creativity, unpredictable, surprising me, blowing me away with every PV and song, artwork like she used to do a few years ago

Well, to each, their own... Secret is her worst album IMO while Next Level is among her best :P

^ I agree with you in 100%!

and

I have to quote you in my signature.


yes I didn't bring anything sensible to this thread lol