yeah its low to bring down other artists to defend someone you like. I think defending is very well and good, as long as you don't make it sound lame like Catzi pointed out, and you have points to back up your opinion. If the other person is just bashing mindlessly, I'd rather just laugh at them cause they look like mindless idiots rather than paying attention to them at all.

Although I don't like it when people defend and they go overboard, even on this forum. I see some people state some on their opinions on a song, cover, concerts, ayu's life and choices, etc and many take offense and start defending Ayu like theres no tomorrow. I think thats when defending gets out of hand when accusations start happening. I'd really hate it if people started defending ayu by telling me I'm a bad untrue fan that can't support her just cause I don't like her hairstyle or something =\

You still have respect people's opinions, but just don't pay no mind those who spurt out stupid comments cause thats just attention seeking. Of course I don't mind fun joke kind of bashing as long as its kept to be tasteful.

I totally agree. I mean I HATED (miss)Understood with a passion, but if that's somebody elses favorite album then I'm not going to off on them and try to change their opinion or something. I think that's just ridiculous! xD

You don't have to love every single freakin' thing she does just to be a diehard fan. I support her through all her decisions, whether I agree with them or not (but there hasn't been one I've not agreed with yet.) There's going to always be a song/album/single/pv/hairstyle or SOMETHING you don't like about her.


EDIT: omg baka-ranger, you have to make me a LJ layout and an Ayu mood set. xDD

Oh just comparing old images, that's all. I don't think she's had terrible work done at all---just very, very common procedures in Asia that you can easily shrug off. Like eye-lid widening surgery. I honestly think she did that (because even though she had larger-than-average eyes before they definitely were not what she has now), for sure. It's not a big deal in Asia at all (hell, my own parents want me to get it). She probably had a tiny nose adjustment too. For the most part, yeah, I think she lost weight and got professional makeup and such, but some things like eye widening and nose structure fixing you just can't do without surgery.

I mean, honestly, she just doesn't look like this anymore. To each his own though.

Well, that photobook was taken 13-14 years ago... most J-pop divas of now looked way different that long ago.

Her eye makeup has gotten quite severe in the last few years [it was the same from 2000-2004... and in 2005 onward, she's added more eyelashes and more liner around the eye. It's pretty obvious when you see her sans-eyemakeup, you know? :p

I wonder how many people have seen Ayu just after waking up. XD

I get defensive for Ayu at times too...but only if it's like really unfair bashing...like MAJOR. Otherwise, I'm like 'ok w/e'. But yeah, I think it's alright to defend her -just don't take it too far.

JOMG today is now official the best internet day of my life:laugh I'm so sad haha I can do an lj layout..just not a moodtheme cause that doesn't belong to me XD

but yeah just so I don't get off-topic, I think some people need to realize not that there something of Ayu that your bound to dislike. Saying you like everything is being dishonest, and it just seems like your putting on a front in order to become a diehard fan. Unless like truehappiness stated..you actually genuinely like everything about her =P
If Ayu make's stupid decisions (which I don't think she would) such as getting an afro...um I'd still support her decision but it doesn't mean i have to love it and go OMG wonderful she's back in style again I am so getting an afro next week.

I think being a true fan is more being able to accept the artists faults and whatever may come and still staying true to them, rather than blind worshiping :no

Actually, nah. That's not a plausible explanation. No matter how much you age your bones can't change their structure. Your face elongates with the loss of fat/aging of the skin, etc, but your bones cannot shift around your face and your brow bone doesn't decide to move itself up a few centimeters.

Take Reese Witherspoon, for example. She's 31 now, and this picture was taken when she was around 16 or so. That's a difference of ~15 years, and yet she still looks the same, save for some chubbiness around her face:



There isn't much difference besides the fact that she got a different haircut and lost some weight. With Ayu.....I mean, man, come on. Her eyelid was waaay more collapsed before and her teeth were all over the place. Her nosebridge was not as high and her nostrils were more flared. Those things don't change with time. And yes, her eye makeup is usually severe, but if you look at the (miss)understood tour pamphlet, for example, there are a few shots where she doesn't wear makeup at all and it's quite obvious anyway.

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/8752/ayuwq0.png

You see how on the picture on the right, her nosebridge seems to sink into her face? And how on the left it's quite prominent? Call me crazy, but I don't think any makeup in the world has the power to lift that nosebridge up in such a way. And on the right, Ayu's eye stops about halfway from her bottom lid to her brow bone. On the left, her eye stops at about 2/3 of the way from her bottom lid to her brow bone.

But okay I'm done. People are free to form their own opinions, but I'm just saying. It's pretty obvious if you look at the whole ordeal objectively.

As long as you stay objective, you don't bash, not acting immature and you don't force your opinion on the other and vice versa (I mean for the other person to do it to you) you can defend, there's nothing wrong with it at all!

One of the things that I hate with those bad opinions about ayu is how harsh they sound.

But regardless. Back when the photobook was taken, they didn't Photoshop or drench her face in makeup like they do now-a-days. A little mascara can make the biggest difference on your eyes. I honestly don't see much difference in the noses. In the younger picture, she seems to be squinting me. I have alot more to say about it but I'm stopping myself because it's your opinion etcetc so on and so forth. :)

Defending her is OK, there is nothing wrong with it, especially if you are a fan. However, I find that generally when fans become obsessed they place the artist on a pedestal and simply cannot see the flaws or accept them being criticized. In their eyes, Ayu can't do no wrong. We know this to not be true, the end of Mirrocle World is evidence enough :P!

I don't care if Ayu had surgery or not, I still love this chick!

That post made me laugh.

all I know is, argument is another spice of the world. World wouldn't be this interesting without arguments.

I do believe that Ayu has had a minor plastic surgery, as she was as beautiful as she is now. But I believe that she did it only with her nose. As for her eyes, I do believe that she did nothing with them. Do you know that when u laugh, usually u squint your eyes. That's what made her eyes in terima kasih photo book looks smaller. But if u see everything in that photo book, u would notice that her eyes is already big. As for eyelids, cosmetics could do that.
But anyway this is my defense on ayumi's plastic surgery. Anyway, I never understand why it is bothering people that she had a plastic surgery. Becoz, IMO, every people, financially capable or not, would love to make a little correction on him/herself and make it better looking.

As for her voice, I can;t make any defense. Though I really want to defend this, I can't say much about this, becoz, the truth is.... yes... She sux. But at least, she isn't as sux as Leah when performing live^^ (No offense to Leah's fans here)

Ugh. There's always going to be people like that. Personally, when someone disses Ayumi (for example) on other sites, I just ignore it. I don't try and out smart them in a post-off. It makes you look like a moron. To yourself and others.

I think it's only bad to defend her when the other party is just expressing their views.
However when it becomes an attack, based on stupidity such as "omg Ayu sucks she sounds like an exploding cat being run over by 500 trucks, I wish she was dead I hate her guts go die Ayu fans"

THEN it's fine. XD

i think everyone has their right to compliment on others. but if it goes too far, I'll verbally stab them =_=

I loathe the Ayumites (ultra hard core defend her if you criticize just 1 little bit, and call her the best 24/7). In all honesty, those times when I dislike Ayumi is mainly because of the fan base I don't want to be situated with. Because some people will think "Oh you like Ayumi, you must be one of those whapanese Ayumites", and thats not a stereotype I'm not comfy fitting in with. Plus I don't really enjoy her current music.

I also hate it when pointless people just pop in another artists thread and keep on saying "My artist is better 101". Comparing other artists can be great, but there is ALWAYS 1 idiot that will pop in and say "HEY (artist) IS THE BEST GET OUT OF HEREZ, DONT SAY THAT YOUR NOT A FAN LEAVE THE FORUM". Those people they try to change your opinion or try to make your opinion not valid are fools. This always happens when there is a neutral comparison as well.

Thank god this forum has Mod's that are good and break up this rubbish when possible.

Just out of curiosity, why the name Ayumite? because it seems rather offensive to me and not that easier to type than extreme fans. I don't want to pick a fight or anything, just curious.

But I do agree with you. Actually, that's how I feel at another forum about another artist (which I will leave unnamed). Everyone seems to say positive things about that artist and praise that artist left and right and I feel like I'm the only one there that's really disliking things time to time.

Ayu having plastic surgery...only the great sphinx will know. I don't really care if she has plastic surgery or not. Heck, even my friend's mom encourages my friend to have plastic surgery. Maybe I'm just not that good at seeing differences, but I don't see the difference in her nose. :shrug

There's nothing wrong with defending an artist, IMO as long as it's for the sake of debating rather than the "MY ARTIST IS BETTER THAN URS 1!11!!!" and having personal attacks, I think it's interesting in hearing what the others say about artists I like and having an opposing view, as long as the discussion is civil.

If they bash, get a laugh out of it, because really, there's nothing you can do.

I dunno were it originated , but in other forums, those extreme fans are called Ayumites, and I guess it just kinda, picked up from there.

The name Ayumite was basically made at JPM as an insult to Ayu fans.

Kinda like how Koda zombies is used to insult Koda fans. :|

You know, uhm. You start that sort of rubbish as well.. o_o;