Dragging this back into Namie territory...

Just watched this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1h0V90ilgM

And realized how fucking incredible the last 10 years of her career have been compared to any other part of it. It's hard to look at those clips and realize that Namie wasn't just peaking after Ayu, Koda, and so many others veritably fell off in popularity... but that Namie was actually peaking in every aspect of her career during the last ten years. These were her most invested PVs, outfits, routines, looks, albums, and singles -- it was like the first 15 years of her career were her building up to what happened over the last 10. And now I feel like I missed out on so much of this because I didn't give more of these singles a chance.

I stepped in and out at times. I was dancing to VIOLET SAUCE when PLAY hit #1. I was in love with Hide & Seek. And I remember when 60s 70s 80s became her first #1 single in years. And I loved WHAT A FEELING and the two bonus tracks that ended up on BEST FICTION. I also was around when PAST < FUTURE came out. And then again when Uncontrolled and then FEEL came out. I remember when ONLY YOU hit JPopAsia. I also remember being disappointed that she didn't put the Japanese edits of Yeah-Oh and Go Round on Uncontrolled. And I was there for FEEL and fell in love with Contrail. I remember LOVING the Big Boys Cry video and actually getting teary-eyed when I first heard the b-side Beautiful. And really, if I think about it, I actually really liked every single one of her singles since 60s 70s 80s. There isn't a single one of them that I can look back and say I had even a "meh" reaction to.

I just don't know why I wasn't tuning in more.

What I am absolutely never going to forget was when Christmas Wish was released. I remember literal spasms the first time that chorus kicked in and I was sitting there just telling myself, "OK. OK. What is this song?! HOW DID YOU DO THIS SONG?!" Have not forgotten it. Unique feeling I only remember having for the very first time I heard Ayumi Hamasaki, the song was "Moments", and I had no clue what I was listening to or watching, but that I was absolutely gobsmacked at how perfect everything came together.

I kinda wish I would have kept my eyes glued to these threads more! Been a part of the excitement and happiness when new PVs came along, stayed on top of the tours, and whatever.

Anyway, moment of reflection. It's just kind of awesome to think she didn't just come back from obscurity, she Came Back, and then she CAME BACK, and then she CAME. BACK.

Oh man, since he produced for Namie I thought it ok to mention here but just found out on twitter that Tetsuya Komuro will retire.
https://mdpr.jp/news/detail/1741455
Apparently it's because he had an affair?

Crazy coincidence they'll be retiring the same year.

Ah, now I understand Timmy´s post on FB.
So in Japan you have to end your career when you have an affair? O.o

Not true . When the tabloids exposed Becky & Gesu no Kiwami Otome / indigo la End frontman Kawatani Enon relationship (at that time Enon was still married and the tabloids dug up more dirt where Enon sent LINE messages to Becky to say that he will tell his now ex wife to submit a 'thesis' aka divorce papers) , Becky bore the blunt of things as her squeaky clean image was tarnished significantly

On the other end while both Gesu no Kiwami Otome + indigo la End went on brief hiatuses , both bands continue on shortly as though nothing happened which I thought it was really unfair for Becky to take most of the hit even though end of the day both of them were in the wrong

That said , it's a bit sad to know due to an extra martial affair that the tabloids exposed , Tetsuya Komuro chose to retire & not give KEIKO a public apology

Nope, this is pretty much a first as far as I'm aware, at least for men. It makes me think he was just ready to retire anyway because men cheat on their wives all the time over there with little to no consequence.

This really does just, along with Namie's retirement, put a bookend on the heisei era. Smap retiring, then Namie, now Komuro; the age really has changed.

It was extremely unfair that Becky's career took more damage. You had people calling the television network demanding she be taken off air, meanwhile Enon had fans telling him "we support you."

I think he was ready to retire as well, as it was quite surprising to hear that the affair led to this. I don't really believe it.

-

Anyway, what are some of the songs everyone really hopes will be performed at Finally? Right now I just really need Girl Talk *_* but I don't think that song will make it.

I think he decided to retire because everyone loves KEIKO and no one will like to work with him again. And that's his second public mistake so I'm glad he's out of business.

Well said. He should have used this opportunity to apologise to her instead of hiding under the retirement announcement.

If that were the case, I honestly think it would have already happened with his fraud scandal, his drug scandal, or his other various cheating scandals.

I know she performs it a lot, but I really want to see ROCK U. That song is always high energy and super hyped so I'd love to be able to rock out to it in person now that I'm going. :banana1

Defend Love would be a great surprise too.

I'd actually love if the majority of the tour ended up being super high energy / dance heavy. It's her last tour, so instead of everyone crying as she no doubt performs all her classic hits before tearing our hearts out completely by singing Finally lmao, we should just be rocking out to all her bangers instead and having the best 2 hours of our life. :banana2

I'm also betting Baby Don't Cry will appear in the encore before the concert ends haha

Yeah both parties were in the wrong (let alone Becky said she already knew Enon was married quite sometime into their relationship) so for her to take most of the hit while Enon got away relatively scot free , it was so awful

I don't understand the way Japan works at times (like they can turn a blind eye on adult porn related matters but when comes to drug charges , it's at the other end of the spectrum) and sadly sexism especially if you're female & mixed , you still don't get the same level of respect as compared to your male counterparts

Also both parties didn't suffer , Enon's ex wife also did & I think she was being led on a three wheeler ride which she didn't deserved

Yeah it's not very hard to issue a public apology that you do in person instead of sending a fax to the media isn't it ?

The fact that TK chose to retire instead of outright apologise publicly to KEIKO , that I feel it's a real coward move to do

And I'm afraid that in future for male artistes who get caught cheating by the tabloids will follow the same way that TK does :no

But he did apologize to Keiko in his press conference.
It's also up on Japanese websites.

Yeah, technically he did. I didn't watch the whole thing, but at the very beginning, he lists her among several other people he feels he should apologize to. So I guess that counts?

Honestly, whether he apologized to her or not means very little imo. If I were her, I'd probably be pissed one way or another because I would just think the only reason he is apologizing is because he got caught and apologizing publicly is what he is expected to do to help save face in Japanese culture. I'd have a real hard time believing that that was sincere, so I'd probably be more like shove your apology, lol.

Now, to turn this back to Namie - it's doubtful it would happen, but hopefully this doesn't effect her retirement too badly in terms of what songs she performs, et cetera.

Oh, this was just stating a fact I've read on Japanese news sites. No judging there from my side at all.
I personally never liked him much anyway, so this doesn't really change anything for me. It's one more bad thing he did.
Even though I also think this definitely wasn't the (only) reason to retire for him. Maybe it is good for Japan that he does though and it leads people to think a bit stricter about cheating in the future (wishful thinking).

Considering his big influence on the music scene and the amount of songs he wrote, I don't think anything will change in regards to artists like Namie continue to sing his songs. Ayu already posted, that she will continue e.g.
His fraud crime didn't change anything as well and , economically, this was much worse than his "private cheating".

Still no news on her Asia tour? I completely forgot she was touring Asia, checked her website, and the first date is apparently in Shanghai on 17th March, just under 2 months. I'm wondering if they'll be cancelled, seems far too soon with no ticket info :S

http://contents.namieamuro.jp/live/finally_in_asia.html

Is she popular enough in China and Taiwan to justify two arena shows? I'm really thinking of trying to get tickets to Taipei (it's only slightly more than me travelling to Osaka within Japan :P ), but hopes aren't too high after the disaster last time and lack of info still.

I wonder if she'd take the same show or an arena adaptation overseas, or whether it would just be her and her dancers?

I want to dance a lot and have a great time and then I want her to sing Finally last so I can bawl my eyes out, lol.

I have high hopes for Baby Don't Cry as it was such a success! One of my favorite Namie songs <3

http://contents.namieamuro.jp/live/finally_in_asia.html

Seems like they added an additional Hong Kong performance.

And the lottery for those 2 dates start later today at 6pm for fanspace members!

Honestly I wouldn't recommend you to try getting tickets for her overseas dates as 1stly the venues are much smaller than Dome (except for Beijing's Bird Nest Stadium which's probably on par capacity wise but Namie is not performing in Beijing)

Also you have to get through language barriers again . Only if you're decently fluent or fluent in Mandarin , let alone Cantonese dialect then you should try your luck to ballot for the tickets

If not don't , just stick with the domestic Dome venues but then again with tickets already so hard to get for Namie's last domestic tour , overseas will be much harder as general sale for overseas dates is based on 1st come 1st serve basis unlike domestic tour where it's balloting

^ I think arena could be better than dome, as there's more chance of being closer to the stage. Very few artists use a dome/stadium to make a more impressive show. Language barrier would be an issue though haha.

I'd have got a dome ticket if I could, but lost in the ballot twice. I haven't seen a single ticket relisted, so not sure if restrictions on them really do mean they can't be resold, which seems odd. Was really looking forward to seeing her and didn't think getting a ticket would be this hard :(

Arena is much smaller than Dome and proximity wise it's better but it's hard to say as it also depends on where you're seated within the Arena venue

Someone like Namie wouldn't do a tour in Premium like venues as these venues only can accommodate at most less than 500 people but the big trade off is that you will be super near her away from the stage unlike in an Arena let alone a Dome & Stadium where you will feel so far away from her

I thought getting tickets to her tour dates in Sapporo & Fukuoka Domes would be slightly easier unlike Kyocera Dome Osaka , Nagoya & let alone Tokyo Dome but guess not but I suppose at this point in time , having a ticket (without you knowing how good/bad your seat is about 2 weeks prior to the concert) is better than nothing

This is why I always get standing where possible, but that's not so common in Japan! Whenever I get standing, I've always been pretty close to the stage.

In this case, definitely, but I couldn't even manage that and there's no more sales now :(

Not true , when I attended concerts in Japan in Live House venues , it was all standing except for some venues that have 2nd floors which have seats

When I attended concerts in Live House venue twice , I stood for more than 3 hours each time (2nd time it was more than 3 1/2 hours) which was really tiring but so worth it LOL

I know for Nippon Budokan there's a section inside where it's the standing arena which has the best view as you're essentially in front of the stage

I honestly thought Namie's Fukuoka & Sapporo dome dates would be easier to get tickets unlike Osaka , Nagoya & let alone Tokyo . Especially since you have to take a domestic flight to both Fukuoka & Sapporo but guess not :x

I was thinking more in terms of arenas. Every arena show I've attended in Japan has been entirely seated. The 3/4000 capacity venues (e.g. Zepp) were a mix, sometimes 1F standing, sometimes all seating. The one dome show I went to (Momoiro Clover Z) was all seating. I typically look at resellers now because even when getting tickets through fanclubs, I've been closer to the back :P

Determined to get a ticket, so really hope tickets end up being resold/more dates are added!

Zepp venues capacities are less than 3,000 . Some of them have 2nd floors which have seats such as Osaka's Zepp Namba , Zepp Tokyo , Zepp DiverCity

Hall , Arena venues tend to have all seats but for me I wouldn't sit in a concert I will stand haha

The assumption is that you will get better seats if you ballot via the fanclub but it's not true as it really depends on luck . Sometimes if you ballot via the general sale your ticket might be even better than a fanclub balloted ticket

https://www.instagram.com/p/BeIck3bH..._amur00fficial

Documentary of Finally is out on Hulu Japan now. It still surprises me how many girls cry when they see Namie. Her "less is more" approach with public appearances really worked for the late stage of her career.

I know this was covered a few threads ago but did anyone sign up for Hulu Japan yet? I have a VPN that I can use for the Hulu Japan service, just curious if they require a Japanese credit card for payment.

She says shes pretty much done everything she could with her career, but I would have really liked to see a pop rock era. Well... ROCK U is pretty much just a pop song, but I guess the word "rock" in the name got me thinking about songs like Damage. If she had an era where she made songs like Startin, until that Day, Because of You, is this LOVE?, decision, (dont) leave me alone, wouldn't that be awesome?

I too would really really like one more performance of Defend Love.

^Personally, I think Damage is a bad song, so I don't miss a pop rock stage in her career, but I see what you mean.

^ "Damage" is definitely a weak rock song, but I enjoy it anyway as a pop song. lol

I think she totally delivered on her collab with SHOW-YA. "Genki LOVERS" was phenomenal (even if it was just a re-recording of their old song). She could've pulled off a rock style if she'd really wanted to, but I guess it wasn't something she really wanted to do full on.

^Shut Up from P<F was treading into the rock genre. In some ways it reminded me of Please Smile Again only a lot more edgier.

I doubt it would happen but I'd love to see her perform something from Suite Chic that she hasn't already done.

I think nobody posted it but m-flo released a remix of Luvotomy with TeddyLoid and it's freaking awesome

https://open.spotify.com/track/40uczKRtoMc8IBWX8Q9xJc

Thank you! Just purchased it on iTunes.

Namie has had just about a rock song per album since Concentration 20. Concentration 20 is her most "rock" song imo.

^ I love her more rock-ish (rock inspired?) tracks. Concentration 20 is great, especially the live version from concentration 20 at Tokyo Dome. Personally, I think her full voice is really well suited to that type of backing, like the Genkai Lovers instrumentation, it sounds very full and very free. Would definitely be really be cool if Show-Ya! Is a special guest and they performed the song...I wonder if she will be bringing any guest singers, didn't she have Crystal Kay guest one show on a recent tour?

4 new goods have been added!
http://namieamuro.jp/goods/

Handkerchief + Cookies + Bank Container (2 Colors)
Mask Case (To hold your face masks, I guess? lol)
"NEVER LAND" Tour Photobook

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I don't like the color of the photobook, but at least the preview pic is better than the poofy black dress photoshoot lol.

Also, random, but it seems one of the members from kpop group VIXX sang Love Story at their Tokyo concert last night.

https://twitter.com/BAPERFECTVIXX/st...39513567830016

This will be the first time that I am attending a concert in Japan, and I am so thankful that I was able to secure tickets to the final show of the tour. As a non-speaker of Japanese, I've had some hardship in understanding some of the e-mails sent through. Am I right in thinking that the ticket will be sent via e-mail, and the only thing I will require is I.D. at the venue?

^

Yeah. About a week or so before your concert date, Ticket Board should e-mail you a download link for your ticket(s).

They actually sent out an e-mail earlier today detailing the ID check during entry, so I think they're going to be much stricter with this concert than with her previous concerts. They list out 7 different things we can bring, but I think the easiest thing for us to bring as foreigners is either our driver's license or our passport. They won't accept photo copies, any ID without a photo, or expired IDs.

---

Also, wtf @ the tour book already being sold out. It was only put up 2 hours ago :shakehead:headache:grumpy

Thank you so much for answering my question, very much appreciated! :)

I totally forgot about Shut Up. It was pretty edgey, and its live performance had one of the greatest moments in any Namie concert.

https://i.imgur.com/oINoUUv.gif

Yeah.... this has me a bit worried now. The same info was posted on her iG and lots of Japan folks are begging to be allowed to change registration, citing how they their original partner can't make it or they used another relative's tickebo account but they want to take their underage child to see her. I hope they figure something out for this because I too couldn't get my friend to make a tickebo account in time so I had a family member make an account. Plus what about all the lucky people to have won two lotteries? Do they expect them to attend both concerts? Those tickets are just going to be empty wasted seats.

Any performance in a Namie concert is GREAT!!!, I personally love CYC? from her Space of Hip Pop tour just cause everytime she had to tell the crowd, Shhhh....it was beyond adorable!

It's understandable they'd put these kind of measures in place for a huge retirement tour such as this one since people may try to sell fake tickets to fans who want to see her. However they should at least make an official resale channel to help solve some of the problems you outlined above.

That was a great version, along with the one from Live Style 2006 that was not part of the DVD but from a fan space thing I think. Where she has to really interact with the audience. She was so cute scolding the audience

Live version of Jolin Tsai's I'm Not Yours featuring Namie that was recorded from Jolin's Play World Tour

https://jenie.co/song-jolin-tsai-im-...-tour-livem4a/

Yeah, just bring your passport. It's actually required in Japan to have your passport on you as a visitor at all times anyway, so you might as well just do that.

Thank you!!

https://www.facebook.com/NamieAmuroO...935335/?type=3

Until recently Namie was definitely a big name in my playlists. Sadly, the tv interview she did in December changed it all, and from now on I am about to express my not very pleasant opinion. It’s an extremely rare situation, that the opinion of the artists I listen to, their attitude or actions influence my view of the artist. This interview appeared to be such case. To be honest it`s not something shocking since most of these things I already thought Namie is but her actually admitting to it just made me feel so toxic about her and before that I simply wouldn`t want to believe it in a way... Namie is gone from my playlists and files I downloaded. I have lost every single piece of respect towards her and I will explain why.

First of all, she is currently 40 and, as she said, she started considering retirement in her late ...20s. I am sorry but do I need to repeat? 20s! If it was the shock of becoming popular or something like that I would understand but no - in the interview, this motive keeps coming back in the span of her whole career. The only reason why she pursued was the dream she decided on, which was to give a huge final concert which happened to be her 20th anniversary Dome tour. After its huge success, she kept thinking of retirement but decided to make things even more interesting by...retiring during the 25th anniversary, release an album a year till then and keep touring. As much as I enjoyed Namie’s music and concerts this attitude is simply outrageous to me. She has made the image of a martyr. What kind of person, who supposedly likes their job keeps thinking about retirement for the whole length of their professional life?

Then there was an initial period with Komuro who produced her early hits. She mentioned huge pressure she felt due to the fact many other Komura’s clients were selling well. Again I got vibes of vulnerable, weak girl who didn’t know where she was. Also, during Komuro’s period, she was guided about every single thing by him: how the song would be recorded, jackets, promotion videos, how to perform the songs… she had literally no single thing to say and she was happy (or sad, who knows now) with such state. All she would do was perform. After this she was left on her own, to be her own producer, and she was totally lost as she said herself. What did she do? She was being an observant “music producer”, definitely not an artist. She admitted that there was a lot of trial and error and by watching the audience she knew what songs were bad. In other words, she just wanted to please the crowds and create things so they sell well - the end of the story. The only positive thing she says is that she has learned to enjoy singing and dancing at the same time, and the moment she started enjoying her work was….learning that it should give her joy….She says she found it but I will not believe it, since she kept thinking about retirement. I have no words.
Then, there is a reason why she stopped going to tv and that was: “I am not a very intelligent person and have nothing interesting to say”. She said that saying something interesting became a burden to her. I didn’t know that in shows like Music Station or others you are quizzed from the history, or they check your IQ. This is the same reason why she resigned from MCs.

This interview was very revealing. What I saw was Namie being a mainstream follower who is much more performer and the producer of music that would sell, very little passion though, rather then an artist.
I try to never do that in public discussions but I will mention Ayu. We may have varied opinions about her music, but she has never, even in the darkest hour said that she was tired. Not only that, she is totally opposite to Namie in this department. Her hearing has been getting worse with time but each time she speaks out, she keeps emphasising how she will not stop singing because it’s her life and those are not words to be taken lightly. She has learned acrobatics, her shows are always spectacular and even if repetitive at times - they are big, bright, theatrical and even if you don’t like Ayu, find her music boring - she knows how to put on a show. She is very involved in the creation process, writing all her lyrics makes her superior to Namie already. Speaking of lyrics, Namie’s English is horrible and without checking the words of songs on the internet - I wouldn’t be able to tell a lot of it. With Ayu, it’s not the case anymore that much. And there is no excuse, if you do something and earn really good money - do it well, learn those few lines at least, by heart. How, after being a fan of such passionate artist like Ayu, I am supposed to just ignore what Namie said, how she made herself a victim of her success? I don’t even believe that she actually decides about jackets and all. The moment she opened her mouth I realized how much Ayu deserves to be called an artist and Namie simply a performer while I used to think of Ayu as a performer with passion. It’s understandable she kept herself quiet, because if she talked people would see how very uninteresting and to some point fake she was. Namie was produced, during all her career, even when she was her boss all she did was produce goods in the forms of music. She just wanted to sell and feel the joy of fans during concerts who had no clue that she put very little heart in her works.

Because of her feeling like a martyr, lack of passion and retiring finally, I am very much not interested in what happens to her professionally. I am glad she is retiring, she was very overrated in my opinion and did not deserve the publicity she got.

This is it tbh.. I hope no one`s gonna start bashing me like crazy although it wouldn`t be surprising because that`s what simply tends to happen when one expresses their negative opinion about somebody or something and especially with a topic like Namie who`s barely critisized, it is something that can expected...

I don't think anyone will start bashing you because everything you said it's true, we all know it, and, surprisingly, we don't care lol everything you said has been overly talked in this forum - too many times, and no one ever said it wasn't true haha

personally, I like Namie's objectiveness and honest about her career - including the reason why she has stopped doing tv shows and MCs.

Namie is a product, a brand, and a successful one. that's what we all should be happy about, though. she has managed to maintain herself relevant for a whole 25 years. she has adapted pretty well to the mainstream, whatever "era" she was on (even though for a sole album she wasn't as successful, it had more to do with her personal life than her music, really) - and since you mentioned Ayumi: she couldn't adapt her music as successfully.

that's how music industry works and I'm sure you'll understand one day that most pop acts are products. and products usually have an expiration date. some fade until no one knows about them. on the other hand, some just choose to leave the stage in a grand way. Namie, for one, is in the second group.

actually, everything you said sounded so naive haha like when I was 14 and used to attack whoever bashed Britney Spears because she wasn't a true artist lmao

Well, you act like I don't understand it but I do... I am aware of all these things - yes, I do know all these things even when I am only 15. For me it was more about her being like "I always wanted to dance and sing" etc. but then thought about retiring so early for example... I know that many acts are produced, this is also why they're not artists really. I know that perfume is produced. Or xy. Ayu was too. It wasn't about the product only but about everything like her making a victim out of herself, excusing not going to TV shows cuz of the talks (they ask question/lead the conversation like, come on girl) and so on.

And Ayu never tried to adapt her music really, as she said, she does what she likes.

are you 15? D: thought you were like my age? haha anyway, it's sad that you won't listen to her songs because of her personality. she didn't commit any crime lol

I prefer not to link personalities with their jobs in music, except if they did anything outrageous (being homofobic, racist, rapist and stuff), but that's me haha

Someone wants a cookie it seems lol

Don't judge namie by ayu's standards. Even tho they have their similarities, they never had the same objective in their careers to begin with. namie never wanted to share her struggles and pain with the public, and she did stick to that, and succeded. ayu wanted to, did that, and also succeded. To each their own. You have all rights not to like namie, but don't try to put her in ayu's shoes.

Plus you thinking of ayu as a non-pop-person but an ~artist~ just shows up how naive you are. Yeah, her music IS more passional and personal and blah, but at the end of the day she also did stuff to please her public and grasp popularity, and that's what everyone in the pop scene does, that's not a sin, as long as you're honest with the image you want to show and the one you are actually showing.

^if you read carefully you would've seen that I know ayu was produced too. She definitely was but i wouldn't say she is nowadays
+ It's not about this whole artist / performer thing tbh. I knew Namie isn't an artist. For me it was more about all the things Namie said and her attitude.

http://www.slate.com/content/dam/sla...l-original.gif

I remember when someone in this forum called her "avant-garde":P. Or how she takes more risks than Koda or Ayumi... by doing electropop :P
That was a nice read Katsuyuki-kun!

With any celebrity, you'll never really know their heart 100% - but with Namie, I feel she's very guarded. I think she gave some insight in these interviews, and some of it less than flattering as you mentioned, but I also guarantee that there was a LOT more going on behind the scenes that is unknown or rumored only.

Past that, I think Namie's goal in fame has almost always been to enjoy herself, and to make other people happy. Unlike others, I don't think it was ever her goal to have a deep connection with her fans - and I think that is why she was so moved by certain moments, like Kouhaku - because she never sought out that kind of connection.

And through various times in her career, when she was not enjoying herself, that made her want to stop. Is it alarming just how often she thought about retiring - yes, kind of. But, at the same time, in the scope of the Japanese music scene that would not have been unnatural. Many idols retire by the time they turn 25 and are "too old." I'm sure as her popularity has changed over the years (good and bad), there have also been stresses behind the scenes with her label, management, etc. that have contributed to that.

And finally, in a lot of ways, Namie is also VERY Japanese. She had a period of rebellion when her popularity fell, when she did Suite Chic, and even Style & Queen of Hip-pop. But over the years, she's tried to erase a lot of that - removing her tattoos, toning down her image to be more girly, etc. I think she has some more traditional values in terms of what she thinks her life should hold, or how she should live it. But she's a very private person, and I believe she holds a lot inside and has never felt like she wanted to or should share that externally.

So I can understand if you feel disillusioned, but I also don't exactly agree with your interpretation. I think if you put her in a Japanese context, it's much more understandable. If you go back to the Ayu comparison, without dwelling on it, Ayu is very non-Japanese in a lot of ways - it was the source of her major popularity earlier in her career, and what continues to hurt her now. So it's not a fair comparison in a lot of different ways.

Namie has always been a "product" of the music industry and I think everyone knew that. I know I personally never expected art from Namie. Because she is not that kind of musical act. She was a TK girl. His creation pretty much. But I don't think Namie is heartless or souless. I think she still cared about the fans and making music that she enjoyed and also dancing of course. I didn't get any negative feelings from the interview or see her as a victim of anything. But I could see how a person could be turned off by Namie's approach to her music career. I thought everyone knew that Namie was more of an entertainer than a musical artist.
When it comes to pop stars, most of them are similar to Namie. They want a career in the entertainment industry and work for record companies. People like Ayu and Utada are special cases, not the norm. That's why Ayu had to fight to gain more creative control over her music career. She was working with a mainstream music company like Avex, where making a profit is a priority, not taking creative risks like Ayu wanted.
I don't think you will be bashed.:)
I think everybody generally has already been aware of what you're saying anyway.

The problem is most of you only focus on the performer thing and as I stated before; that I knew and it didn't surprise me nor is it a problem. Much worse I found things like her excuse for not attending music shows, constantly thinking of retirement and so on... Don't want to over-repeat it either..
I just don't buy her enjoying it so much when she wanted to retire all the time..

^ I can see what you're saying, and obviously you're entitled to your own opinion on it. But I think one way that you could choose to look at it is - she wanted to perform, and loved to perform. She also wanted to be famous for performing and have that lead to success. What she didn't want, and what made her unhappy, was all of the expectation around what that fame and success encompasses.

Whereas most stars are personalities, I don't think she ever wanted that. She didn't want to be judged for who she was or how she acted, she just wanted to be judged for her performance alone and to keep the rest to herself.

It's definitely a very abnormal approach, but I don't think it was disingenuous either.

I don't know about you, but I don't even have a job and I'm already thinking about my retirement money. Why wouldn't she? Hahaha

I think voltron explained it really well.
I know it may make Namie look disingenuous when she expresses that she has considered retiring multiple times over the years but is that really that abnormal? Namie has had ups and downs in her career. When something gets difficult, quitting can seem like a viable choice. Plus she was very aware of how the business works. When she started to lose her popularity, she was thinking, I guess that's it my career is over. But instead of giving up a career that she enjoyed, she decided to stick to it. Because of her diligence, she found success again and revived her career. I believe that rekindled her passion for performing. So she kept going for a few more years.
But now that she is entering her middle age and 25th anniversary she has decided that she is ready to move on. "Finally I can stop dreaming". She realized her dream.
I also think it is understandable that she delayed her retirement until now because she wanted to end her successful career in a specific and special way.
I bet there are so many popular singers who think about quitting all the time, for one reason or another. They just aren't as honest as Namie is about it. I don't think that considering the option to give up on something makes someone fake.

I just don't believe this whole thing with her loving to perform, maybe she liked it but if she really loved singing and dancing her dream wouldn't be to retire (yet with a bang) and she definitely wouldn't retire at such young age. Her dream would be to do it as long as she could and that's not the case as we know. Maybe she liked it, but I wouldn't say it's love.

I still don't see why not going to music shows or constantly thinking about quitting is a problem. I read your bible, but I still think you need dishes to do, or a new videogame to play because your reason to not like her and all is so... stupid.

HAHAHA yes! :luv2

It's not not going to TV shows itself but it's her, let's say, "stupid" reason not to go because she has "nothing interesting to say". She can give an interview, so she can talk a few minutes and answer basic questions. Quitting is a problem to me because I have a strong dislike for this kind of attitude that she has, only thinking about quitting all the time when she supposedly likes/loves her job..

I think perhaps you have a romanticized view of music stars. Not everyone can be like Ayu, performing until they physically can't do it anymore for the sake of the soul and art. For a Japanese female, Namie has had a very long career. Japan is ageist towards female pop stars. Usually careers only last 5 or 10 years if they are fortunate. So in a Japanese point of view, Namie is retiring at a significant age.
And the dream isn't to retire. It was to do what she had a passion for and be successful. That interview showed that she did in fact want to excel at being a pop star and be as successful as she can. She did all these things. I think she wanted her retirement to be a grand celebration of her long career and so if that meant waiting 5 extra years she wasn't going to let that change her vision. She isn't just saying, I'm bored with this so bye. She didn't have to release the Finally album and remake her hits and begin a huge farewell tour. She easily could have released a greatest hits collection and one new song and said goodbye. But she is putting in a lot of extra work that she doesn't have to do. I think perhaps that is an indicator that she does care. Retiring before old age doesn't delegitimize her career or sincerity. It's quite normal actually. You have to look at the whole picture. Namie is a very nuanced person.

It's not only ayu, it's like many other artists and even performers too... And actually, many Japanese singers are still there from "older times"... I don't often hear about someone retiring at 40.. Outside japan it might be a different story, yes, but even inside Japan it's not like everybody just retires... I wouldn't say I have a "romanticized" view since I am aware there is not only ayu... It's also not only about her retiring at 40 but her already thinking about/aiming for it at much younger age when she wasn't into her career for long time. Many Japanese singers are still out there - just not as successful. But they prefer their job, passion etc. over success. With Namie it's pretty much the opposite thus she retired too. I do understand that she wants to go while being successful still but I personally have a dislike for that... I am not denying the importance of success though.
And let's just assume she actually did love her job, retiring (so she can go while being successful) would say enough about her even then.

So is your post. As if "doing the dishes" or "playing videogames" and disliking the attitude of a singer are somehow related.

Momoe Yamaguchi retired in her early 20s during peak popularity. That's unheard of here in the west. Singers retire at all different ages and for their own reasons. I just don't see the problem with thinking about retirement while being active. Retiring is part of the job, sooner or later it will happen. Would you hold it against someone if they thought about death before they die?
I guess I just have a different interpretation of her than you do.

Obviously you can think about but also, she was dreaming of this huge farewell concert all the time, the way she presented it is like all the time she couldn't wait to finally finish her career and go while she is still at the top. Like, what's so wrong about going without a dome tour if you can do what you supposedly 'love' for a much longer time... For me it's really just, ugh, this kind of 'dream' just is so 'toxic' to me. I just really have a problem with that but I do see your point and understand it... And obviously I wouldn't with the death but if we'd adapt Namie's situation to death, it'd be like someone having a great life, not old tho, who can't wait to be older and finally die so he can look back at their life.
Obviously I WILL want to look back at my life and be happy when I die but I don't want to think about it now that I am still young nor do I want that in 25 years. Same with whatever passion / job (supposedly Namie's/my passion)

I'm sorry, sweetie, if my post upset you, but I didn't mean to be disrespectful to anyone. I just think it's a really stupid/dull reason to dislike someone or their work just because they're not extremely passionate about it, or because they don't do some things. NO ONE needs to do things they don't like. She doesn't like to go to TV shows, and just because she's a singer, she doesn't need to do something that's umconfortable to her.

Coming here and writing a book just to tell all the reasons you don't like her and giving those reasons, for me, sounds like a bad use of time, and doing dishes, studying, playing videogame or even sleeping seems like more productive things to do.

It's not anyone's obligation to like someone, so I just wonder why that kid took time to do that. And judging by most of replies here, people didn't really get that either.

Yeah, I tried to read that wall of text and it's making me glad that I'm not that invested.

It's me expressing my opinion and I never said Namie had to go to TV just that the reason is pretty... yea... I said it already... She didn't have to perform either if all she wanted to do is to retire. I don't just like the person who makes music because if they share private things it does influence my view of them and believe it or not, it's fine.. Do you always go on here and wonder why people write posts about their opinion just because they're negative? I suppose you don't. You don't have to agree with me as well. And at least I show people here respect unlike you who is writing down things that could be a better use of time. For me, it was a fine use of time because for a long time I wanted to express my opinion about it and yes, I still study etc..i never said that Namie needs to do this and that. I didn't write that she should perform on TV or such and by the way, it was more that some reasons were not understandable to me.. and yes it's not my obligation to like her but fact is did like her until I saw this to me revealing interview.

Just like I hope people respect my opinion I respect theirs as well and I even understand how one can question me for not liking her after this anymore. Well, I explained it already. Yes, at least she was honest about, that I appreciate but still, I can decide not to listen to a singer because of their personality and that's fine. You only focus on 'less passion' and TV while talking about my reasons. Namie always was less passionate and it was fine. But that's not all. I don't want to start writing down more reasons since I already did that.

And just so you know, it would be nice if you wouldn't refer to me as a kid. This post might come off as 'offended' or 'mean' but as much as everybody can express their opinions, reply to me with this and that, I don't like being referred to as a kid and I also don't like someone telling me what they think I do is a bad use of time and what I could do instead.

I also don't plan on writing about it forever, I just wanted to express my opinion, if talk would develop I won't run away but I in no way wanted to somehow kill this thread's mood. People should keep enjoying Namie of course.

You could use some paragraph breaks...

I appreciate the passion but to keep arguing your point is kind of... well useless. If you don’t enjoy her anymore cool but you can’t get defensive when coming into HER topic and then writing a novel on why you don’t like her because she’s not super passionate like ayu or something. But alas, I respect your opinion.

That was...a wall of text.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I don't think you're being very fair. As consumers, none of us will ever understand the pressures of the industry that these stars feel. And she was FOURTEEN when she debuted. Fourteen! And she kissed any and all hope of a normal childhood-into-adolescence goodbye when she and the Super Monkeys came on to the scene. Are you really going to begrudge the woman her hopes of an early retirement and a semblance of normalcy when all she had ever done was live in the spotlight? It doesn't mean she loves the music any less. Nevertheless, she persisted. I don't understand how you can hold that against her.

^I don't fully buy that childhood excuse. I normally would totally agree but didn't she/they want the fame and were disappointed when it didn't happen immediately... It's not like she didn't know what she signed up for... and it was something she wanted.. I do understand her wanting a total normal life and will give her that yet that doesn't change what I wrote above.

Her private life is pretty much still private tho.

let me get this straight: why are we discussing this? are we trying to prove the boy wrong and make him like namie again, or is it just to prove him wrong? I mean, everything that should be said was already said and we are just moving in circles right now imho. namie is a perfectly normal human being: thinks about her retirement and dislike talking in public. nice, let us move on and if one doesn't like those things about her, well, I'm pretty sure she's now mourning the loss of a fan.

Um. Anyway!

Hope is probably my favorite new song off of Finally now. Wish it had a video.

Problem is that you are focused on one thing and you want everyone to respect your opinion about Namie, but you are not respecting her opinion about some particular things.
On one side, you are constantly criticizing her, on the other side you don´t want to hear (or understand) any explanation she offers:
"I just don't believe this whole thing with her loving to perform..."
"I don't fully buy that childhood excuse ..."

you basically "not buying" any Namie´s explanation. You are not open to discussion then, because you have your opinion of HER and you don´t want to (or not able to) hear HER explanation and her point of view because then you are simply not buying it. You just "bought" one (according to you negative) part of interview.

^Me not believing a person that they love to do something while they only think about quitting for 20 years etc, is not not respecting her opinion but questioning and yes critisizing her for being even if not in a direct way, hypocritic. I do respect what she says, what people say, yet not everything is really convincing on her side. I do admit that her being star since she was 14 tired her out in a way yet it is true she did want the fame with her group, she did know what she signed up for. Me not agreeing to/being convinced by certain arguments doesn't mean I don't respect other opinions. Other users here disagree with my opinion yet they still respect it. "Buying" something or not doesn't have to mean I dis/respect the person. And what I "bought" from this interview came from her opinion that I respected, listened to yet disagree with etc.. After all, she was talking in the interview so it's not like somebody else was talking in her place, assuming things that "I bought".

^^And no need to refer to me as "the boy" either, given my age, I understand, yes I am a boy still but I also don't refer to other people here as "the man" or "the guy" etc.. One can use either their name or the gender appropriate pronoun. It sounds more natural as well. I know you then went one with pronouns but still!

I am very grateful for Katsuyuki to express his opinion which I share. I was into Namie but the stuff she said was pretty meh to me. In my eyes, she did work, enjoyed it but that piece (retirement) she simply kept bringing back. The image of the super perfectionist was simply the person who likes her work ... to some extent. I can agree that some people think of retirement early although it's beyond my understanding. I love my job (teaching) and retiring hasn't come to my mind even once. Namie is Namie so she does as she wants and that is totally fine, but not everybody has to agree with her reasoning or the way she approaches retirement or simply her job. I am taking a break from her too, most probably will get back to her at some point.

Also, I disliked the attitude of some people here. It felt like it's not fine to express elaborate criticism about her in her thread. Well, people keep criticizing Ayu on Ayu forum and the sole purpose of forum is expressing an opinion and respecting each other. Calling people to "go play videogame" or referring to them as "the boy" is really low and disrespectful. I am totally fine with others enjoying Namie, her work and the way she is retiring but it's definitely fine to read the opposite point of view as well.

Didn't know that referring to a boy as the boy was offensive lol it didn't sound offensive in my head when I wrote it (nor now).

But anyway, everyone can express their opinions, but for every action there's a reaction, and coming to Namie's topic to bash on her attitude and career choices of how she portrays herself to the media/public isn't very smart of a move.

I guess the thing most of us can't understand is: why does it matter if she was thinking about retirement, of doing a grand goodbye stage (sort of following the steps of Yamaguchi Momoe and other big Japanese acts that have done such goodbye stages)? Why does it matter if she doesn't like to go to music TV shows or talking during her tours? Her job is to be a singer. She sings. That's it. Everything else is pure promotion and she didn't feel like it anymore.

You don't like that she is straightforward? Too bad. We can get back on track. I guess we're lacking Namie's tour info and that's why we kept on discussing this lmao

My favourite song from Finally is In Two.

Daaamn didnt know Harry Potter 8 was out yall in here writing essays lmao

—

Love reading opinions like this tho tbh.

HAHAHAHAHAHHHHHHHAHAA GOSH I'M DYING

My favorite song from Finally is Finally, and again: I'm hoping so much for a Finally x Never End version/medley as the last song of the tour T.T

I would squeal seeing her all around if I was in Fukuoka!

It's not that we don't respect or want to hear his opinion, it's just that to us it doesn't seem logical. I think Namie has been completely misinterpreted here. Yes she has thought about retiring at different points through out her career/life, but Katsuyuki012 is making it sound like all Namie has cared about for the last 20 years is when she can finally quit her career that she never cared much about in the first place. That all this time Namie has just been faking it and her big dream was to finally get out of the music business because she never really cared in the first place. This literally is not true. Part of what he is saying is factually wrong. The rest is opinion and that part is totally fine. No one needs to like Namie or listen to her music or support her in anyway. But the notion that she has no passion for her music career because all she cared about was when she can quit just isn't true. That's not what the interview says and it just isn't what happened.
Namie has had rough patches in her career and it was those times when she thought, maybe I can't do this, maybe this is my time to bow out, my era is over. That is perfectly normal for someone with a popular music career to think about. She got married and divorced and had kids and had family murdered, the media turned on her, her sales were quickly declining, she lost popularity and lost direction in her career. All this while Namie was a teenager and very young adult. If I was her I would consider quitting as well. She is only human. But I think most importantly, Namie did NOT quit. She easily could have but she never gave up her passion. She persevered through the hardships and it paid off big back in 2007/2008. I think she was greatly inspired by her warm reception back then. It rekindled that drive to be the best Jpop performer she could be all over again.
As for the tv appearances, as it has been mentioned, Namie is very much a Japanese woman. She does not feel comfortable making social public appearances. She is reserved and shy. So instead of forcing herself to do something she didn't believe in she made the decision to stop. She wasn't interested in being a celebrity. She wanted to be an ambitious Jpop entertainer. Not an idol. It actually makes Namie more authentic. She wanted to stop doing publicity because her heart wasn't in it. She wanted to focus on making music and putting on a show for the fans.
She wants to retire now because that chapter of her life is over. She accomplished her dream and now she is ready to start a new chapter in her life. Dreams and goals can change in life and that is only natural. Doesn't mean you never cared in the first place. Namie dedicated 25 years of her life to her music career. That is more than half of her life!:dead2
I think Namie has earned her respect as a Jpop legend. Boycotting her music because her philosophy towards her career and goals doesn't match up with yours just seems immature. And it's pointless now because her career is over so it won't really matter.:no
I also don't see what the issue is with discussing this topic. Everyone has been generally respectful. I can say that I want to hear everyone's opinion no matter what. I still appreciate Katsuyuki012 sharing his thoughts with us.:)
It's interesting to discuss Jpop no? It's not like this thread had a great conversation going previously and Namie isn't very active right now so why can't we discuss Namie's career?:shrug

Well, to the boy thing: my opinion stands what I think about being referred to like that so I don't feel the need to go into further discussion about it.

Expressing their negative opinion isn't bashing, I didn't use insulting language towards her or anybody either.

The TV I already said, it was the reason I don't understand 'not having something interesting to say'. If she doesn't want to go then fine, just that reason made no sense to me.

About retirment I don't need to say more though.

You don't know if I like that? You don't. I do like anyone being honest. Yes, it gave ME new insights but still I appreciate her honesty in this interview. One could say you all don't like me being straightforward about my opinion either. But that's not what I want to assume.

Anyway, as you said, let's get back on track. I am glad I could express my opinion etc.. but obviously this thread shouldn't constantly be about my negative opinion about her.
So, there you go, for me there is no need to expand this talk since it won't really get much better or change anything. May everybody have a good day/evening

Edit: just now saw your post EndOfTheWorld lol, don't think I will add something about this Namie topic since it would be kind of hypocritic given the fact what I wrote above but I do appreciate your post and I do agree on the part that yes, at the end she didn't quit all the time when she could have (now she obv will but you know what I mean).

I think what got people irked up was that Katsuyuki012 came into Namie's thread and wrote a long post to explain his various reasons on why he lost his respect towards Namie after he watched the subbed interviews she did

Over the years since I started listening to Japanese music , I stopped supporting some artistes along the way but I don't suddenly go to their threads on here and start bashing in on they're currently doing , that's a very pointless thing to do and it's 1 way of getting into online spats easily

Likewise I don't agree with 100% of what Katsuyuki012 wrote and subsequently wrote in response to other users' remarks . Am I offended by what he wrote ? Yes and no but I wouldn't go and say that my opinion is better than him cos everything is so subjective

Also Namie ain't the only artiste to stop appearing if not never perform on TV shows . MISIA is 1 that I immediately think of

Some are more invested in Namie than others . For me , I only care about her music while I don't bother so much about her personal life . Someone pointed out that she has been in the business for so long since she was a teenager so she got to see certain things that us 'normal folks' ain't able to

Perhaps Namie's Japanese fans don't take into her emphasising so much on bowing out of the limelight unlike us especially what she has gone though over the years in her personal life

End of the day I'm sure most of us agree that Namie has accomplished over the last 25 years is remarkable . Not every artiste is lucky to last so long in the business

On a side note , does anyone wants Jolin Tsai & Namie's I'm Not Yours performance from Jolin's Play World Tour ?

It's okay! I've pretty much said just about everything I can say.:laugh
I personally enjoy these topics so it's good that you sparked a conversation of substance.:thumbsup

Another namie ayu comparison piece, here we go. You can’t attack namie just because she’s not Like ayu. What ever happened to individuality, people please. So she wanted to retire early, can you blame her after everything that happened, shot gun wedding, divorce, losing her mother and popularity. So what, if she wanted to end her career with a bang, who doesn’t. She’s not a talker, we all know that tv shows just want the “kawaii” personality. Maybe, she’s tired of acting that way, since you know she’s not 15 anymore. I see nothing wrong with making music fans enjoy. Why is that a bad thing?? Express your opinion, good for you. But don’t try to minimize her accomplishments just because she’s a “product” like everybody else.

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Can I say how amazing Do Me More is to this day? It just came on via shuffle, and the intro alone makes me scream. And then that rap bridge. What kind of perfection of a song. I hope it makes an appearance during the tour.

^love do me more, could be a bit shorter though

^ I agree! It could be a whole minute shorter tbh.

Speaking of Do Me More, I was listening to BEST FICTION the other day and didn’t realize Wishing On The Same Star was a different mix than the one on Ballada (the version I listen to the most). The one on BF is a little longer by like 15 seconds and features some ad-libbing from Namie. Seems like she has a lot of different mixes of her songs for her compilation albums.

^four songs on Ballada are new Ballada-mixes. I called them either (new mix) or (new mix 2014) if they already had the new mix tag on Love Enhanced. These songs are I WILL, NEVER END, Wishing on the same Star and Dreaming i was dreaming.

Some of the arrangements are vastly different from their single or original versions. Most of the Finally mixes I like (especially Dr.) although there was one I really didn't like - WHAT A FEELING. It just felt underwhelming. Otherwise though, I generally liked the practice of mixing up the versions.

DO ME MORE is GOLD!

I love the Majestic feeling everytime the song starts.

Do Me More is the SHIT... sexy girl also ownsssssss

MUSIC STATION on Fri aired a Top 5 favourite Japanese artistes poll that foreigners like (surprisingly #1 on the list was Rock band RADWIMPS)

Namie was mentioned in the sub Favourite charismatic female solo singer category

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The foreigner that MS interviewed sang a bit of Hero and she said she likes the song cos when she listens to it , her heart is felt with happiness

Even though shes retiring, I think theres a good chance she will still perform Hero at the Olympics.

Guys, can you help me with something? Do they sell the goods on the date and venue of the concert? There is this cute 500 yen Keychain I want and the white t-shirt, but even the XL is small for my size (and I'm thin/average, but I'm 1,92m tall - do the math to inches cause I don't know Haueha), so I was hoping to take a look myself before choosing to buy a 40 dollars shirt.... Haha

Me bugging everyone on every artist's thread about live tickets. Bear with me, I have so many favs and want to go to all of theri concerts but suck at organising. I don't see on namie's official site any indication as to how apply for the tokyo dates of her show. The application round has already ended, or it hasn't started yet?

Yes they will

Odd that they haven't announce the timing of what time the concert goods will be sold & the tour will begin next week o_O

Also I think sample T-shirts will be displayed at the rack so I think you can take and try it on ? I don't know if that applies for Namie's though

The ticket balloting for Namie's last tour has already closed , be it if you're in her fanclub and/or if you ballot via the ticket application codes that're included in Finally