are we really supporting ayumi by d/ling mp3s???
 

well, in order to support a music artist, you would purchase items related to them, either directly or indirectly. am i wrong in saying this? now, im not saying people here do not buy ayu-chan's CD's and whatnot but...shouldn't we stop d/l mp3s all together? well, there are exceptions, like the unreleased tracks...but that should be as far as we go, right? i don't mean to offend anyone, it is only my humble opinion. i'd like to hear from ahs members on this.:)

Shes already rich... and she's already coming out with a new single. Don't get me wrong, I love Ayu but shes got to slow down a little. You have to be Bill Gates if you want to own all her stuff >_<.

i spose so...but that only includes music...

By DL MP3s, you're not directly supporting Ayu and Avex. They make no profit in having people downloading MP3s, but I don't think that people should immediately stop because of it. To me, I think that while downloading in general isn't the best way to go, at times it's the only solution for people who can't afford it or buy it from where they're at. I don't think it's bad that people download to preview tracks before buying, so while I'm not the richest guy in the world, I'd definately buy Ayu's CDs whenever I can afford it ;) !

Whoa...For a second I thought it was the same person posting three times in a row arguing with themselves. LOL...Anyway, I don't think it's bad to dl mp3s exactly. I mean, that's how I really got into Ayu. Also, I back up all my Ayu CDs by turning them into mp3s, so I'm still supporting Ayu and stuff.

but liking jpop, especially ayumi, isn't cheap. i would love to buy her cds, but i don't have 30$ or 40$ to spend on them. i'm lucky if i can buy an american cd that costs 15$.

everyone makes a very good point..no one really has all that money to burn =//

Hmmm, I've already support ayu [partially... I guess] because all ayu's original CD that I have are only the album CD. For the single CD, I can't find it anywhere on my place.
So, basically, what I download is the single remix track(s) only....

Why not buy online then ????
Well, I'm not a rich people, and have no credit card either...

So, the conclusion is:
I will buy every ayu's CD if I find them on my place.. Yup, I definitely will buy all of them...... if only they were sold on my place...

Meh, I don't want to spend lots of money and wait several weeks to get Ayu singles in the mail. I buy her full albums. And I'd buy a lot more if I didn't have to order online, pay shipping, and wait.

many mp3s downloaders are potential buyers. If it were not for the mp3s, I doubt a lot of ppl here would even know who ayumi hamasaki is. I for example don't buy any of her stuff because I don't have a job yet but as soon as I have one (and a credit card ekek) I will try to support her as much as I can....until then I'll have to keep on relying on the mp3s =/

Agreed. Music from other countries, especially non-European or Latin American ones, is difficult to find in America. I personally heard about Ayu from the Internet and I got to know her music by downloading mp3s. Now, I own several albums and a few singles by Ayu even though I have a good amount of her mp3s on my computer. I believe I'm still supporting her as an artist, just not for every single song that she does, and I don't think that is necessary. As it has been already mentioned, I won't elaborate on just how wealthy Ayu is from all of us crazed fans... XD;

dling mp3s isn't at all that bad. If u have no means of buying the CDs (online or offline), it can be the only way for u to listen to ayu, and that's okay, but if u do have means then by all means buy.

Buying online isn't really a problem if the store or the seller accept payment by money order, ur only problem is if the postppl loses the m.o., which btw hasn't happened to me yet ^_~

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Sorry but I think that's an absurd analogy. If I go to a store and steal a cd, I'm stealing a material thing, the cd case, the cover, the cd cotaining the proper data to be played on a CD player, a material of quality. The CD store spent money on that material thing and by stealing that you are doing a direct damage to that Cd store.
Owning a mp3, if you don't have any ways to getting the actual cd is a completely harmless thing. Plus it's not as if the person who owns it would buy the cd anyway if he/she couldn't and there were no mp3s. Mp3s have a slight worse quality than the CD, plus if you burn it on CD the quality gets horrible. I don't see why you compare a computer data with a material thing.

If you are talking about US (or any other country with a strong currency) than I'll keep quiet (even though I bet these japanese import cds are even expensive for people who live in richer countries - unless you're japanese or live in other asian countries that have no need to import), but I'm actually not north american. Computer and internet here are quite chaeper and a LOT more useful (my parents and brothers can make use of it, while ayu is a personal taste of mine only), as are american cds which I can afford them no problem. But importing japanese cds is way too expensive because my currency is not dollar and prices in dollar usually get too much expensive (and not worth the pay) if I have to convert my currency to dolars. Plus the shipping helps to make the costs extremelly expensive.

So we shouldn't listen to Ayu at all if we can't, at the very second she releases an album, afford to purchase it? That's more than a little absurd. And what about getting bootleg CDs on ebay, that's not supporting Ayu either, in fact it's WORSE than downloading mp3s, but no one seems to care.

If I hadn't downloaded mp3s, I wouldn't have bought the 45 Ayu CDs that I have. It's not like we live in Japan and can hear her music on the radio. Pretty much the only way to become a fan is to download something to become interested.

This is not even REMOTELY like walking into a store and taking an album and walking out. If I were to do that, I'm preventing someone else from purchasing that album by taking the actual CD. If I download the music, I'm not preventing anyone - not even myself - from buying the album. Most likely, either the person downloading mp3s wouldn't go out an buy a CD anyway, or is eventually going to. There is no loss of business because most people wouldn't go out an buy the CD even if they couldn't get it on the internet.

One of the reasons I download any mp3s at all is because we can get them a week prior to the actual release date of the album. I want to hear what I'm purchasing...

Ashley

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yeah, i listen b4 i buy!!! or i wont buy!!!!

I have no way to purchase her music.
The CD stores around here don't carry it.
I do not have a credit card, so I can not purchase items online.
I do not have friends who could buy it and mail it to me.
And more importantly, I can not afford to spend $30 on a CD.

Re: are we really supporting ayumi by d/ling mp3s???
 

She's already rich! Here in Brazil is very hard to find a Jpop CD, and very expensive, so mp3 is the solution...

I don't think DLing supports her, but sampling her music and going off to buy her cds does.

nope..

id buy all the albums/singles but its so hard for me, i dl em now but ill eventually buy em i really will :weep i feel bad now

If it was not for me downloading a couple of songs, I would never have becomed interested in Ayu. I have since bought two of her albums, A best and I am, and glad I did. I will continue to add to my collection, as I believe you should only use filesharing to sample music that you otherwise would not have heard of. I have also downladed the odd single, not of Ayu's, but I am generally less interested in singles, I rarely buy them, I am interested in full albums, which I would not download.

My view anyway ;)

I did what most did, I downloaded some Ayu mp3s as preview. When I got some money, I started buying CDs and stuff - and I buy whenever I can, which isn't very often. I delete the mp3 songs when I get them on CD, but I keep the ones I don't have, or if it's not possible to get them any other way.
There's nothing wrong with downloading songs as a preview, and then purchasing CDs later, but just downloading without buying anything isn't supporting an artist.

even though i download about all of ayu's songs from winmx and kazaa, i feel that it is wrong for us to do this. i think it isnt fair, and we arent really supporting her. i guess you can say she is rich, but if we were truly her fans, we would by her cd's. its hard for some of us though, so we get it for free. But now i feel like kazaa and winmx stinks because of the RIAA and such. every artist is getting angry, and im guessing ayu is one of them since she is very popular.....

i think downloading is good..i knew ayu from downloading her free & easy video off some jpop forum and now im addicted to her..

I totally agree with you! Because if i buy a new single and i dont like it, i wont buy any other things from this artist. So i download Mp3, and i buy after... And i have a mp3 player too! I make other listen jpop by this so i need mp3.

everyone makes very valid points here. ^_^ but aren't album sales a part of a music artist's success?? please keep in mind this is only my opinion:) isn't there a ranking based upon a music artist's album sales? (I know there is one...just can't think of the name...)

most songs i liek now a days are dl by chance, and if i hadnt i wouldnt have liked em in teh first place, then i wouldnt have todl me friends.

so im actually PROMOTING and ADVERTISING stuff artists in a way lol... ive gotten liek 5 people to leik ayu and theyve all dl, but theyve at least bought an album already, so in teh end it works out decently...

well it's taken me a wbile to get from downloading to actually buying the stuff, but that's not really my fault. Look at the facts, i live in the UK where access is about zero, not to mention most places only allow order by credit card, which i didn't have access to until last year. An exception to the credit card would be cdjapan, as they allow international postal orders, except for one problem, UK doesnt issue international postal orders >_<. So only in the last few months have i been able to actually buy anything. I also forgot to emntion, that ontop of all of that theres also the problem of money. I mean look people, we're not exactly made of it are we?

First of all, do you know what portion of record sales actually go to the artist? Very very very little. Most artists receive their income from concerts and television performances, etc.
I only buy CD's I know I really like. I never buy singles, because honetly, they're a huge waste of money. I live in Canada, so do you know how much a CD from YesAsia costs me? A single is about $15 PLUS shipping for like 3-4 songs, while I pay $40 for an album. I bought Ayu's Duty in the States for $45 Canadian. I'm a univesity student paying $11,000 + a year for tuition and board, I can't exactly afford to buy every single CD I want to listen to. I know that's a poor excuse, but I really don't see anything wrong with MP3's. Though I'm sure the RIAA would give me a very hefty fine for my MP3 collection hehehe....

I download stuff I'm curious about. If I like it, I buy it. I would never have bought any Auy stuff (what a horrible thought) if I hadn't had the possibility to download mp3s (I heard about her online by coincidence). Now I've bought 40+ CDs (from Avex) and some DVDs and other stuff. But if I'd only bought one album Avex still would have profited, because, well, they don't advertise here in Sweden and the products aren't available to people who don't search for them and order online.

Sure, maybe some people spend less money because of mp3s, but others spend more. Like, because of the fact that I could download concert videos I discovered ELT and DAI too. For me it's been a chainreaction that started the second I opened the door to j-pop.

Linzy, that's true. I'm sure most of Ayu's money comes from commercial deals, etc...

Also, Avex has a lot of limited Ayu releases that you couldn't go out and buy even if you wanted to. I don't see any harm in downloading those at all.

Ashley

I say WORD to Impact and Ashley!

Also, do you think Ayu achieved such great international success simply by selling hard copies of her music? NOPE. I would say-- no, I would ASSERT-- that most of her worldwide success is owed to the internet and its abilities as an advertising/sharing medium...this includes offering her music to thousands of people who couldn't otherwise hear it. Some business exec in Japan didn't say, "Hey, let's toss a bunch of Ayu's CDs into a bunch of different countries and see what happens!" People started putting her songs online and the Ayu Addiction spread.

right, i definitely agree with you there linzy...as with everyone else too! yes, success is measured by quite a few factors, not just selling CDs...good to hear some thought out opinions here! ^_^

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The way I've seen the MP3 vs. CD debate, you're dealing with actually taking a physical item vs. taking random 1s and 0s, which doesn't necessarily equate to the same thing to me. While "stealing is stealing", then what can be said if you, for example, copied an MP3 100 times to your PC? Would that mean that you've stole the song 100 times, or 1? And about being a fan, I don't think you need to own anything to be a fan. It's just like saying "I like [insert name here]'s acting skills!" You don't have to own their DVDs or watch their movies to like them, considering there's movies you can watch on TV! And finally about the example for stealing chocolate, that falls in the category of "Does that person really need it? Or are they simply taking it because they don't need it?" Instinct can override logic at times, so to some people, esp. those who are perhaps poor, they know it's wrong, and yet when a person's stomach tells them they're hungry, some people would do anything for it, even if it means stealing to know that perhaps they won't go starving that night.

If there was a way for that someone to DL the chocolate flavor and taste it using a computer device it woldn't be like stealing a bar of chocolate (the person would just feel the taste but wouldn't be able to get hol of the material part of the chocolate - consistency, nutrients, etc) ahhaha ;) just kidding...but well, everyone is entitled to their opinions and I respect yours becuase you are actually showing your points instead of just saying it's wrong and THE END. ;)

That's great, but it really seems like you haven't read a thing anyone has wrote about the actual stuff besides the music that you get when you buy a CD. You just keep repeating the same stuff over and over, and I don't respect that.

Actually, that's a very good explanation and it really makes sense when comparing it to nick's analogy of chocolate and CDs. I mean, a CD includes a booklet, a case, a print on the CD, the actual CD, pretty pictures, and sometimes enhanced features. The mp3s are very much getting the "flavor" without getting any of the texture.

ya by dling u dont really surportting but everything starts from dling stuff cos if u dont dl u wont get to heard how she's like. many people dl stuff first then if they like her they buy. but yeah dling is really not supporting i can understand.

What i do is i dl ayumis everything then i go and buy it haha X_X i'm werid but dling comes out faster then the real thing at shop. X_X

I'm supporting ayumi i do buy no worrys

Yeah....it's physical items which I think is stealing, vs. DL an MP3 (and at a much lower quality than a CD) that doesn't seem like much of a big deal to me. If anything, people should get arrested for humming songs or printing lyrics, since that could also be considered as stealing the artists' works :roflmao !

The CD packaging and extra features are a big part of the fun of getting a CD. Yes, mp3s and music are the most important part of an artist's product, but my opinion is that the CD offers a whole lot more. However, I think few people would buy a CD if they had not heard the artist's music. Most people hear about singers and groups from outside sources, be it their friends, at a social gathering, or--the major source--radio.

Okay, radio is free, but that is how artists disseminate their works. People that are interested will go and buy their CDs. However, most of us Ayu fans don't get access to radio and mp3 is like our experimental medium. Whether one keeps or deletes their mp3s is up to them, but would you say that recording a song off of the radio is stealing music? I personally don't support people that just get free music without buying some of the artist's albums and products. When the artist's music can convince you of their coolness, then buying their CDs is like thanking them for the work they've put into it. But it's not like one has to buy every single CD or have no mp3s.

That's true.... buying an items means you're supporting them and hoping that they'll continue making new songs, but at the same time, you can still support them by cheering them on at a concert, for example. What I don't get is that if the RIAA and all those types of organizations dislike MP3s so much, then why not go after the blank CD makers and the people who make 20GB mp3 players? If someone has 20GB of MP3s, then surely they have some songs which they didn't buy. I don't get how the blame can be shifted to the people who DL it so easily, and yet none of the people who essentially support such things don't get any feedback.

hmmm i dont want to interfree this topic... but i think dling ayu's things is legal because you know... ayu's CD's ISNT EVEN SOLD IN SURABAYA!.. if i live in jakarta maybe i will buy all of her stuff but since jkt was far away from sby (singing far away ^^) then i hjave no way to say (singing no way to say) just dling them... the reason i get the cd of memorial address or other cd's is i told my friend to buy it from me wheter he wants go back to sby (he is in sgp) and it is absolutely a rude thing if i keep tell to him to buy all of ayu's stuff... (i will get killed by him) ok? :)

right...well, at least everyone here has a good attitude towards mp3's. you guys (nd girls) only dl mp3's to sample music, then buy accordingly. dat;s great to hear. i kno of people d/ling mp3's even wen they have access to buy the albums, etc. that is not commendable...i commend you people! ^_^...btw...anyone have the scans from the January issue of Cawaii magazine? if u do, can u kindly send them to me? thx! :thumbsup

I agree that buying the Cds are more supportive than downloading, but I definitly wouldnt have any exposure to Ayu ifI didnt download (and I definitly wouldnt be able to see her videos)! Living in Vancouver, I would probaby be able to find some of her Cds if I searched Chinatown, but I'm pretty sure they'd be fakes! So the only way is over the internet, which means breaking out the credit card, and I dont really have the money... s I WILL buy the cds... just later when I'm rich.

downloading maybe synonimous to strealing in many ways, but in many Asian countries piracy is much more of a problem to the music industry than those people who download from the net!!! Piracy is much of a concern to companies who produce them than mp3's.

no clue if i've responded to this, and not to sound rude, but what kind of question is this? of course NOT, especially because many "fans" of some artists own next to nothing by the artist, and have stacks and stacks of downloaded material.

i totally agree. it is human nature that if something is free, its good. more "fans" prefer free stuff, rather than supporting their idols and spending their hard earned cash on good quality material.

there are other ways to support an artist besides buying their cds....

maybe so. but as long as the artist produces music, their main priority is to sell as much CDs as possible to cover up the production cost and earn back what they deserve in cold hard cash.

:yes Trueness. Most definitely.

And then, how's going around yelling 'Ayu is DA BOMB XD' ever gonna support her? Just buy the CDs, shizzle.

Same here. :shakehead

NO. mp3 downloaders stink.

sigh...don't you guys realize that people who only download wouldn't buy the CDs anyway if they could? I mean who the heck would buy such an expensive album by some Japanese artist and in a language you don't even understand?? But thru free downloads, a portion of the people who wouldn't normally buy the CDs are going to purchase it. So there's NO LOSS for the company. There's only GAIN. If we follow you anti-download people's logic, then taping a movie off tv is just as bad and people should should buy the DVD of every movie they've seen.

btw I dare anyone to come out and say that they've never downloaded something without buying it straight after, or they delete the mp3 after they've heard it once. Not many people I presume.

If you listen to their song and spread it around, their popularity rating would increase thereby become more in demand (i.e.more advertisement /movies.) They could similarly earn cold hard cash thru endorsements.

don't defend stealing, it's just plain wrong. if you like an artist a lot, you can still spread them around, but at the same time encourage people and yourself to buy the cds. the advertising thing is just plain wrong, if an artist relies on advertising to get money over music, there's no musical integrity *coughHKpopcough*

if there's no one buying cds, there's not gonna be many companies that would want to deal with the artist. perfect example, sonim. she has fans, many fans, but she got dropped from her label because of poor cd sales due to leechers.

the fact that you can't afford something is no excuse to download. if you can't afford something, you shouldn't be able to have it, it's a slap in the face to the artist that worked hard to make the track and to the fans that actually bought the product. jpop, and music, is not a right, it's a luxury. if you can't afford it, i guess you should be listening to your radio or internet radio stations. the people that buy it and share it are very nice for doing it, but they don't seem to understand that it hurts the artist more than it helps them.

ps, excuse the lack of capital letters, it's early =P

i dont think it is good
i only download the videos like ayuready
where it is not for sale
i only buy her cds
some out of stock ones....no choice

wow. such differing viewpoints. and such legitimate arguments O.o hmm..well, i guess what everyone is trying to say is here is that while it is good to buy an artist's album in hopes of supporting her/him and hoping that s/he will continue to produce quality music for us to enjoy, we sometimes lean toward the direction of just getting the music in another, less expensive, more convienient way; and that way is by downloading mp3's. in response to what Unimatrix said, i couldn't agree more. what coerces people to download mp3's is the availability of the mediums in the market today. iPods: sizes range from 10-30 GBs. DVD-ROMs: lots of capacity. used for backup discs and/or "mp3 file backup mediums". that's just the way human nature is. freebies are much better than items that require us to deduct from our hard-earned finances. heh...seems like this issue will be floating around for quite some time, huh?

I think downloading mp3 is okay, not as serious as stealing something from CD store. People are saying some "fans" doesn't own any single yet have tons of downloaded materials, what I would say is even if there is no mp3 those people WILL NOT buy the album and single because people like that just won't. So don't mention them as if they will boost the record if there is no mp3.

On the other hand, some people just cannot afford to buy Ayu's cd, maybe they're still studying (primary, high school) and have no income themselves. So are you saying that they should starve themselves to buy Ayu's cd because they only get a fix amount of money each week from their parents to spend at school? I don't think so. They have the right NOT to buy the cd in my opinion, simply because they are not yet considered as consumers, at least they don't have their own money. Compare to a rich kid (get as much money as he want from parents) who owns all Ayu's album and a poor kid who can only afford one single by starving a week, tell me if that rich kid is a "true" ayu fan and should you mock the poor kid that you're a "lame" fan? Just remember it's not like everyone is rich.

I think ayu will appreciate it if you like her songs, and she definitely aren't that money-minded until she wants to squeeze every single cents from her rather poor fans. For me, I would say I want to save my money now, my parents is supporting me hard to study overseas, and I WILL NOT spent extra money on Ayu's CD and albums that I can get if I go to Pacific Mall in Scarborough or order online. My reason is those are NOT my money, they are my parent's money, very hard-earned, and are meant for my studies not for other luxurious stuff. I can only continue to let ayu be in my life if I can download her mp3 and see where is she going.

I will buy her CDs if I have started earning my own living. Till then I will survive on mp3s. The difference between me downloading mp3 and not doing it is that Ayu will eventually fade away in my life. Downloading mp3 won't deduct one record in sales, not in my case when I wouldn't buy even if there's no mp3. But because of mp3, ayu still in my life.

Those people who keep saying we should ban mp3, you should realize that you are one lucky kid or you have reached the point of life where u can really afford them and think about other people who is not in your situation.

I think yys113 raised some good points. You don't need to have loads of Ayu CDs, DVDs, Posters, or anything else with the Ayu "brand name" to be considered a fan. Just enjoying her music should be enough. Here's something which may be considered OT:

In an episode of South Park, Kyle, Stan, and Kenny wanted to start their own band, while Cartman wanted to start his own. They placed a bet to see who would get their CD to go platinum first. By the end of the episode, Cartman just wanted to get his CD to go platinum and get loads of money, while the 3 boys realized that music shouldn't be just about the money or status, but knowing that people appreciate your music.

Sure, artists and producers have to make a living, but how many people need a car for every day of the week? Money does change people, so who knows how I'd act if I had several million dollars, but the point is that once some artists get millions of dollars, it may not be about the music anymore, but how much money they can get into their pockets.

Ah! For the third time I agree with what AfanforXX said. I had a bunch couple Ayu mp3s and even her Rainbow album downloaded. After a while I felt bad about my 50 CD-rs with music videos and other stuff. I got rid of it all though! All I have now is a CD-r with 3 Daria episodes (never released on dvd), and 2 CD-rs of random J-pop mp3s. Once I get all my x-mas CDs I'm throwing all my CD-rs away because I'll have my legally purchased CDs to listen to....:)

i thought it was a given that if you really like an artist, you'll support him/her the most you can. no one ever said "Starve yourself" to support an artist, that's kind of overly dramatic, and the whole "she won't miss this money" argument is just making excuses to keep leeching, it's not about the greed, it's about having respect for the artist.

you can like an artist without owning anything by them, but you should also try to support them all you can, and saying "AYU IS DA BESTEST ARTISTE EVAR!!!!!!!1111" doesn't count because many of the people who say this don't even own 1 single item by her.

I only download because I am going to buy it in the near future. I downloaded songs and deleted them after memorial adress came out with them. I know there are many people here only for the download section. these people don't usually participate in the forum AT ALL.

It's cool the only reason i downloaded her cds and stuff a while ago was because my mom and I were afraid to order her stuff online because of the whole SARS thing yeah it is funny in a way and she was afraid to use her credit card. So i started using money orders and stuff and it was alright and plus i download to preview tracks now it is alright in a way :)

i'm 14 years old which means i'm too young to

1) have a job
2) have a credit card

which means i have very few ways of earning enough money to buy any of Ayu's cds. I am fixing to buy Memorial Address and I Am right now but its rare occasions i have enough money to do that kind of thing.

while mp3 downloading is technically 'wrong' some people .... well i shouldnt say 'dont have a choice' because they do lol... for some people, especially people in my situation, the only way we can listen to Ayu is through mp3s.

Let's just take into consideration some people's predicaments before we bash the entire situation. There are always going to +'s and -'s to things so... yeah.

I'm going to agree with afanforxx here. Mp3s are okay, if you actually BUY the CDs. You know what % I think people actually buy the CDs around here? Maybe 2%. Seriously, too many people are cheap and don't buy anything and cry about having no money. I know, there are a few people who actually CAN NOT in no way get them. I mean I've met people with like 10000 mp3s and they own maybe one cd. It completely disgusts me. If you have no money, GO MAKE SOME. You can get a job, you can do chores for other people, there are SO MANY OPTIONS. If you time to sit at home all day and listen to mp3s are cry about having no money YOU HAVE TIME TO MAKE SOME. I don't have a job or allowance, and I've got over $200.00 in stuff from saving money I do get. Sure it's not her whole collection, but I'm working on it.

Do you work for free? I don't.

If you only download mp3 and never buy CDs you are stealing from all the staff needed to bring the music to market, not just Hamasaki Ayumi and some executives at avex. What about the musicians, composers, mixers, designers, photographers, stylists, custodians, printers, CD factory workers, warehouse workers, managers, etc? All these people deserve to be paid for their hard work. The guy sweeping the studio floors doesn't have a car for every day of the week, and the guy who operates the CD pressing machine can't make money from product endorsements.

I download mp3 because that is the only way I can preview new music, as Japanese music is not played on the radio where I live. When I hear a song I like I buy the CD eventually, even if it takes a few years to save enough money for it. I have hundreds of CDs.

I download to evaluate artists to see if I like them. Since the speakers on my comp suck, I just burn them before listening to it on the comp... (Stupid, huh?)

If I like the artist, I'd buy some of their stuff, like skal said even if it took years and years for me to finally get it...

Buying bootlegs is okay too, as long as you plan to buy the real thing... (unless of course a real thing doesn't exist)

Whether burning and buying bootlegs is okay or not really makes my head hurt... I don't know...

its just plain and simple, if you don't take stuff from someone has worked for that's basically stealing. of course, mp3s arent stolen literally, but the ensuing chain reaction will rob the artists and others that have worked to produce these products.

I have 2 CD-rs now out of over 60 after deciding not to burn music anymore. I realized it's wrong especially since I didn't plan on buying most of it. Now I occasionally will download music and if I like it, I'll keep it until I will get the CD. If I don't like it I throw it away or use it for my latest art piece where I hang cut out pieces of CD-rs on strings with about 10-15 pieces per string. Now not only are they used to rip off artists and staff, they can be used as art!!

I just got Shiina Ringo's second album on BT and I love it, and I put it on my X-mas/B-day wishlist since I have to save up for buying people x-mas and b-day presents for the next five months...If I don't get the CDs for X-mas or my b-day, then I'll buy them right after...:)

Eh.. I think we are all guilty for downloading. I downloaded the song "INSPIRE" than I received the single a few days later that I ordered from YesAsia.. I don't really have burned CD's with her songs.. but honestly though, we all do it once in our lives