[orbitalaspect]

Originally Posted by NintendoHTF1242

That was a great read, but how come for the Halsey shade? I want this tea.

I don't want to go into the full mode on this here because I just did so in the 56th Utada thread. I'll just say I have extremely strong opinions on Halsey, and none of them are good.

Originally Posted by KarenPang

Last Fri's MUSIC STATION which featured Namie

https://www.facebook.com/jpopoodoo/v...7065793611723/

Also for the record , Namie's 2nd surge in popularity started to climb back around the time when Queen Of Hip Pop was released in 2005

PLAY was released in 2007

Totally true. But it wasn't really until PLAY that she started really topping Oricon again. I remember the headlines when PLAY came out. People were like, "IS SHE BACK?! ...SHE'S BACK!!!"

OK. Now, back to Katsuyuki!

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

As if it matters what she writes her lyrics on. Also, Namie just works to the same point, it's not like she's overworking hours in a dark room to be perfect. It's not even something I expect from both.

It was just an example. I think people tend to put Ayu on a pedestal, and have for her entire career, because they think she has unique depth as an "artist". Ayu is an amazing songwriter, but my point is not to inflate her talent as something you wouldn't find in another artist... like, say, KOKIA or RURUTIA, or in Utada, or maybe in Ai Otsuka (who not only writes her lyrics but also produces all of her music). Every artist has their "edge", and I'm just arguing that you should bring Ayu back down to Earth.

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

Real Me, Feel The Love, Lelio etc, plus, I said that with Ayu it's not that much anymore, not non-existent

And I can point out GO ROUND, ONLY YOU, Mint, Sweet Kisses, Big Boys Cry, and many more songs from the last several years that Namie really nailed from beginning to end. I just brought up the Ayu examples because she's had some pretty bad English pronunciations in some of her songs. It's difficult for most Japanese singers because the R sound in Japanese is significantly different from English. Also, our language is among the hardest ones to learn because the same consonants and vowels can have significantly different pronunciations based on common usage.

In Ayu's favor though, she WAS married to two people whose first languages are English, and she did live overseas for some time.

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

I was talking about tours though.

Fair point, but there are a lot of people (including myself) that find Ayu's dramatics on stage to be overblown and depleted of entertainment at this point in her career. I am absolutely in love with SHU-YA, but if I have to watch another dramatic interpretive dance between him and Ayumi, I am going to pour bleach in my eyes.

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

God, so because she's a japanese star she can't move away? Well, it's stupid to hold such thing against her. I wouldn't do that with any other artist either. You can live where you want to live. Ayu still came here and even if "only" for business, she did all her duties so it's not like she just left her fans. But if you see this as an argument - fine. She did get bashed for it, so it's not like she "got away with it".

No, no. People, including me, hold it against Ayu because she said in 2008 "I will not leave you" and then she tried to leave in 2010. And then she came back in 2011 trying to say that the tsunami made her choose between her and Manny. And are we supposed to be thankful that a massive disaster was what convinced Ayu to care again? Because I remember when she said that she wouldn't stop caring at all, even if she lost her hearing entirely.

And this isn't intended to bash Ayu, but I'm just clarifying that Namie never came out and swore up and down that she would never stop making music. That she was going to be a "professional" and keep going no matter what. Namie was just tired. And frankly, I think Namie wouldn't be tired if she could walk through an airport without being mobbed. Namie has always been very private, and always needed her space to reset, and I think it's just been years and years of her taking little breaks here and there when she's really been needing a lot of time to herself. Keep in mind that she's kept this career up through raising her son. She's missed a lot of those moments in her son growing up because she did make fans a priority. She's also largely been away from relationships since her divorce. I think it's fair for her to hang up the knee-high boots and go have coffee with some new guy, or go to the park with her son, or be able to stand in the crowd with other parents at graduation.

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

It's not about Namie not writing but about the fact Namie should at least learn her lyrics by heart and so on (e.g. also better proununciation for English songs, whatever you say, Namie's proununciation is worse in most songs).

I can't even tell you how many times Ayu has hilariously forgotten her own lyrics. There are memes. There are memes.

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

Yea, and Ayu still didn't victimize herself or (said that she) got tired.

She certainly did when she tried moving to America with Manny in 2010-2011. I don't know where the links are on this forum, but Ayu even addressed her "comeback" in 2015 leading up to A ONE. She talked about coming to terms with her career and status and wanting to find her way back again.

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

Nowadays roles with Ayu and Namie are the opposite.

I don't know what you're trying to tell me there though, that this made it harder for Namie because she only lives for success or what? Ayu, still loves performing, puts out music and tours so yea.

I literally cried over how bad MADE IN JAPAN turned out. I literally cried, Katsu. The second week of May 2016 is one of my memorable emotional points in the last five years of my life. I even wrote a lengthy post on the album's thread about how I just wanted Ayu to try. I just wanted her to care a little more. And at that point, she had let me down with A ONE, sixxxxxx, LOVE CLASSICS, Winter diary ~A7 Classical~, the singles-turned-mini-albums LOVE and again, and LOVE again, and the release of Terminal as a single, and how every CDL had become a preview of the next tour.

So, I just broke over Ayu when MADE IN JAPAN came out. Because I was holding on for a LONG time and hoping she would get her spark back after leaving Japan in 2010. I really was holding on. I thought FIVE was a good step. I thought PQ was a misstep. And then I thought LOVE was a misstep, and then again was a misstep, and then LOVE again was a misstep. But I work in analytics, Katsu. A trend is a trend. And I just don't know how you're not seeing how little Ayu has invested in her career in any other way besides touring since 2010.

This is way off of any comparison to Namie, because that's not the point. And do I still look forward to hearing what Ayu does next? Yes. But when Namie announced her retirement, I had an OMG moment. If Ayu announced her retirement tomorrow, I would honestly just feel a little disappointment. I'm not saying Namie is better than Ayu in any way. I am just pointing out that I have been where you are with Ayu for years (in fact, my obsession with Ayu outlined so many moments with my old best friend of 12 years... he introduced me to her in 2006 with Moments and I got to be around for the release of Secret. And I still think JEWEL is one of the most amazing ballads I have ever heard.) but I do not feel like I have missed anything the same way I do about Namie's last 9 years.

Originally Posted by Katsuyuki012

Besides the obviously very sad thing with the murdering, all these things are/were under her responsibilty. And it's not like she couldn't expect media's reactions.

Well, those are my, more unshared thoughts. So yea, eh, nice day or something like that. Still, I think the topic is pretty, "done" and there are better things to talk about like upcoming concerts etc..

Again, the point was that I wanted to share some perspective on my end as someone who wasn't a huge fan of Namie but has looked back and felt like I should have been more of a fan over the years. We can agree to disagree on this, and that's fine, but I think you put Ayu on a pedestal and unfairly judged Namie (a completely different artist who started with completely different circumstances and faced completely different hurdles in her career) based on the really awesome things you see in Ayu. And that's great to value Ayu. But Namie is really awesome too. And we really got to see her best these last 10 years or so. And that's really cool imo.

Originally Posted by CeReSu

Can you stop talking about Ayu in this thread and stop comparing Namie with others artists?

Namie, Ayu... they are all humans who, asides their brilliantly carrer, made personnal mistakes, as everyone on this planet. And they can do mistakes. When I read the comments, its like some people think of Namie or Ayu as goddess who are not alowed to make mistakes or bad choices.
Life is hard too for everyone, for Namie, for Ayu... so everyone handle it as much they can.

Every artist works, reacts, feels differently from each others, so why continuing to compare them all the time? Especially since Ayu and Namie have nothing in common, really.

So, the tour is coming pretty fast, I'm so curious to know the setlist <3

Totally agree! Highlighted quote! I don't think Namie makes "mistakes". I just think, even on my own as someone who wasn't a fan, that Namie just had a stellar career that really stands on its own like other artists' careers.