evolution from AT07 and CDL0708 the same?

noidea · #1 28th December 2008, 10:15 AM

Hi,
I just listened to the evolution from CDL0708(DVD-version) and i thought it was AT07! So I played the 2 versions over and over again and found out: everything after the part where Ayus in the air in AT07 is the same o.0
Did you guys know that?
Well, now I have a question, does anybody have the TV-versions of the two performances and can upload them? Id like to see if the evolution from CDL0708 was playback or later exchanged with the track from AT0708.
At the moment i think a few things are possible
a) both performances were playback
after i watched Ayus high kick in AT07 again, i think its possible
b) first was oversung in the studio, second playback
same with above
c) first was live, second playback
possible, but after the perfect sound in the kick?
and everything with the cdl being live and exchanged with the AT07 recording for the dvd

so, what do you think? is it really the same or am i going mad?

alternarist · #2 28th December 2008, 12:02 PM

oh cumon.. evolution is a song that ayu doesnt needa depend on anything. she can sing live.

noidea · #3 28th December 2008, 12:06 PM

she sings it live in most concerts, til yesterday(when i discovered this) i thought she sung it live in EVERY concert and im sure she sang it live in the newer things(AT08, happy x-mas) and older concerts, and as i said: maybe she sung it live, but the dvd-versions ARE the same, maybe she just messed up something?

waterballoon · #4 28th December 2008, 05:26 PM

The thing is, whatever you hear in the DVD are tweaked and edited so that Ayu sounds as perfect as she can be.

evolution is a song that she has sung a gazillion times, so she would have some 'style' that she sings. In both the concerts, she may have made different mispitchings etc, but after Avex's magical editing team, they both would most likely sound the same.

noidea · #5 28th December 2008, 08:23 PM

thats why i asked for the tv-versions, at least cdl tv version was a live broadcast, wasnt it?

Ayumi_lover · #6 29th December 2008, 09:51 AM

tv version of evolution in CDL07-08 sounded the same, but you should find fan-rips on tudou.com of Asia tour where unedited sound of AT07

SURREAL__RAINBOW · #7 29th December 2008, 11:35 AM

im gonna check them tonight!! xD

maybe they used lipsinging again(?)

noidea · #8 29th December 2008, 12:31 PM

if the tv version of cdl0708 really sounded the same, it was lipsynching, because they are really EXACTLY the same, youll notice it if you listen to the songs line for line, always switching between the two, also, her performances of evolution on happy x-mas show 2008, asia tour 2008 and cdl(?) 0506 sound SO different, she was just singing it so good for asia tour 07 and cdl0708(though the good singing in the first one is understandable, it was the first song of the evening with a choreography she did like thousends of times xD in live and rehearsals)

Ayumi_lover · #9 29th December 2008, 04:40 PM

^well, it's somehow anyway strange because first part of AT07 evolution was balad so it's not the same track to lyp-synch
and what they only did when editing CDL07-08 - is just cutting Peco and Princess voices, but they weren't loud at evolution so it's not the deal, but i'm thinking that at CDL0708 this wasn't full lyp-synch, it was half live, because her voice doesn't change dramatically through all live concert.

noidea · #10 29th December 2008, 09:29 PM

maybe they resung the first part of evolution in studio? but from the line after she gets down on earth and the song is normal again its EXACTLY the same, not just extremly similar, THE SAME, im just too lazy to cut them and invert one so i can proof it xD and I dont know about her evolution lives on the cdls and tours before AT07, i think she sang it on AT06 and CDL0607, too, right? I still have to download and listen to them, i think its possible that they already used the evolution playback(i just call it playback to have a word for it, ok? im not saying it was playback) on one of these

Ayumi_lover · #11 30th December 2008, 04:35 AM

^all others is live, and mention that AT07 dvd came 3 month after CDL0708 TV broadcasting, i'm not saying anything but avex love to make 1 track and than put it on every dvd where possible

Okay, wait me to fine non-edited rips of AT07 so we can talk then

keikeiaznqueen · #12 30th December 2008, 05:09 AM

Well, the thing is, I pointed this out when CDL07-08's TV version first came out, and I compared it to CDL06-07. The chorus part was exactly the same, especially during the audience interaction part towards the end. Her voice went the exact same way!!

I'm not comparing it to AT07... so maybe Avex used the same track over again. =w=

People weren't really convinced. But really, there's no way it would sound exactly the same right?

SunshineSlayer · #13 30th December 2008, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by noidea

she sings it live in most concerts, til yesterday(when i discovered this) i thought she sung it live in EVERY concert and im sure she sang it live in the newer things(AT08, happy x-mas) and older concerts, and as i said: maybe she sung it live, but the dvd-versions ARE the same, maybe she just messed up something?

I mean Happy xmas was obviously live because it sounded awful. As for CDL 07/08 and AT07 being the same, I don't know because I haven't taken the time to really compare, but I suppose it is a possibility - the really high kick at AT07 always seemed odd to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterballoon

The thing is, whatever you hear in the DVD are tweaked and edited so that Ayu sounds as perfect as she can be.

evolution is a song that she has sung a gazillion times, so she would have some 'style' that she sings. In both the concerts, she may have made different mispitchings etc, but after Avex's magical editing team, they both would most likely sound the same.

I think what he is trying to figure out is if in fact Avex and Ayu re-recorded the song to dub onto the DVD for both CDL07/08 and AT07 OR if it was lip synched. (the way to find that out is to compare with the tv version of cdl07/08) maybe you can find the tv version in the dl forum because I no longer have it on my HD.

I know we are getting to this lip synching issue A LOT lately and its probably getting annoying, but I think it is because she has in fact been doing it more often lately that more and more people have been picking up on it now. What I don't like is the denial of it, not just from fans, but from Ayu's team themselves - especially since one of her main selling points has always been her honesty to the fans. I remember when Evan Chan (Chinese singer who saw one of her China dates) said that a good portion of AT07 was lipsynched Ayu's team came out with a message essiantially saying that Evan Chan was mistaken. (I may be waay wrong about that, but I seem to remember something like that on here.) I would much rather Ayu just come out and say something along the lines of "due to the deterioration of my hearing and my voice, there are some performances where I think it would benifit myself and the performance more if I lip synch." I'm sure her and Avex would never admit that, but I would at least appreciate her honesty about it even if I prefer her to sing live.

Ayumi_lover · #14 30th December 2008, 05:35 AM

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?rytyzqxlmnd

well, okay here i found video of ballad part of evolution. You can see that this part was live comparing it with dvd version, she is singing the same way, but some details are different
Like the biggest one difference:
in DVD:
bokura wa naite ita n da(vibrato)
wow yeah wow yeah wow wow yeah

in LIVErip
bokura wa naite ita n da(no vibrato)
wow yeah wow yeah wow wow yeah

i'm still looking for second part of evolution

SunshineSlayer · #15 30th December 2008, 06:01 AM

^Thanks for the clip. What would really beneficial though is to have another bootleg clip to compare it to though because we can never be sure how much avex might edit the DVD. The ballad part seems like it may always have been live though.

edit: alright, this is sort of bugging me now, so I'm going to rip all three evolutions - at07 dvd, cdl07-08 dvd, and cdl07-08 tv, if I can find it that is.

Ayumi_lover · #16 30th December 2008, 06:12 AM

no need to rip cdl07-08 dvd, and cdl07-08 tv - that was ly-synched, but i'm sure that AT07 one wasn't

SunshineSlayer · #17 30th December 2008, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ayumi_lover

no need to rip cdl07-08 dvd, and cdl07-08 tv - that was ly-synched, but i'm sure that AT07 one wasn't

Actually I'm in the middle of doing it right now and, while I haven't compared all of it yet, so far CDL07-08DVD and AT07DVD do sound exactly the same - I'm talking down to every little inflection in her voice.

SunshineSlayer · #18 30th December 2008, 07:06 AM

Ok, I've finished comparing the two (making a video now with the two edited together) and they are for sure the same audio track - no question. Every note is held the exact same length, every vocal inflection is the same. So either Ayumi rerecorded the song and put it on both dvds, or both of them were lip synced - it all depends on what the audio of the tv version is.

Also, usually in her lives of Evolution, she shouts out "Come on!" during the woah yeah parts, but these are absent in these two performances.

Ayumi_lover · #19 30th December 2008, 07:09 AM

well, as for me they just can use AT07 track to lyp-sunch already live track at CDL, because ballad part is definitely live

SunshineSlayer · #20 30th December 2008, 07:59 AM

Ugh, the sound keeps cutting out when I try to weave the two together, so I'll just upload the two full performances separately and people can see for themselves.

AT07 DVD: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=H2HGM2MB

CDL07/08 DVD: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=RBPU6OYZ

Please disregard the difference in audio quality (they put Ayu's voice more in the front on the mix of the secret dvd than they did with CDL), but focus on how each note is sung the same and held for the same length.

I'll upload the tv version too when I find it.