How do you feel about Ayu wearing fur?

[koumori]

^ ShiSeido, Chibi-Chan, welcome to reality.

You cannot go around insulting people for their opinions. No one hear has insulted you for yours, so how you can start whining that your excuse for being so rude is 'you're against so many opinions in this thread' is really not going to be listened to. I'm guessing people are obviously against yours - especially by the way you phrased it, you didn't really help yourself - and yet they still manage, on the whole, to not retaliate in the way you did over their posts.

You're baiting an arguement, and you know it. Please stop. Discussion is good in every forum, and it only takes one post to ruin it. Like the ones you both wrote..

[Zahara]

"Just because I make clear, how disgusting some of the comments to that cruel fur business are does not mean, I am gonna start to hate AHS members."

You're not being rational. Everyone has different opinions on fur, but that doesn't give you the right to insult other people for their choice in wearing it. That's like someone saying they find you disgusting because you wear faux fur--that can destroy the environment.

[happiholic★]

I, personally, am against wearing fur. I would never do it, and if I had my way no one else would be able to either. But, I understand and respect that other people have different views, and that doesn't make them any less of a human or any less "right", regardless if it is Ayu or anyone else. I know that I have my views about things that people would say are "wrong" but, I believe it is my right to have my own opinion, and it goes the same for everyone else.

[Yum!Fruit_Salad!]

Doesn't bother me in the slightest if she or anyone else does. To answer the second question, something like this won't affect her or really anyone.

[Aderianu]

People who against it don't know how cold winter may be

[kendelle]

Originally Posted by Chibi-Chan

everybody who is informed about this topic and thinks it's ok to wear fur is an ******* who likes it when animals get tortured.

This is just ridiculous. Don't put words into my mouth.

You want to talk to and insult me like you're some holier-than-thou from PETA? Hypocrite much? PETA euthanises 99% of the animals bought into its care and keeps their bodies in an industrial-sized freezer bought with donations to its fund. At least those wearing fur aren't letting the animals death go to waste.

Pfft.

[Chibi-Chan]

PLEASE WATCH THIS VIDEO

I think you guys don't get what I'm saying:
I have clear, moral values which include that NOBODY HAS THE RIGHT TO TORTURE ANIMALS! All the more not for making big profit. As said before my poit is not about killing animals is bad, it's about torturing animals is bad!

I won't deny my values because anybody feels offended.
Some of you guys seem to think that there is nothing wrong if you say those things:
- they are only animals and we also eat them
- fur looks good
- it's reality and we can't change the world or industry, so you can wear fur because nobody will change something

And here begins your part. Of course you can change something! Maybe by saying things like this:
- I hate cruelty against animals!
- I don't wear fur and don't want that you are wearing it!

Because you guys say 'everybody his own opinion and ideals' this situation only exists! If you guys would say thinks like those mentioned and be strict against it the industry wouldn't make any profit. Of course it's a slow process till most people are convinced but YOU can breake the first ground!


By the way, I have nothing to do with PETA.

[Yumsushi]

Originally Posted by kendelle

PETA euthanises 99% of the animals bought into its care and keeps their bodies in an industrial-sized freezer bought with donations to its fund.

PETA also rallies against testing pharmaceuticals on animals and talk about setting labs on fire yet their senior vice president has no qualms about using insulin which contains animals products... what an amazing bunch of people.

Originally Posted by Chibi-Chan

Because you guys say 'everybody his own opinion and ideals' this situation only exists! If you guys would say thinks like those mentioned and be strict against it the industry wouldn't make any profit. Of course it's a slow process till most people are convinced but YOU can breake the first ground!

I don't think you really understand...

Even if you want to believe it, THE FUR INDUSTRY WILL NEVER CHANGE. Sorry, but that's the truth. These videos have been around for a long time, which I don't even watch because, come on, do you really think these videos are saying everything true?

And that's not me condoning the fur industry. That's me being realistic. I have not given my opinion on if it's right or wrong, because there is no point, especially here in an Ayumi Hamasaki forum.

The point everyone has been trying to make is, you went overboard on your last post. Everyone has a different opinion. You can't start insulting people because you don't share their views.

[MissElin_]

It's such a lame excuse to say that there is no point of being against fur since the industry wont change. That's just a fact for lazy people. I can't think of ANYONE who have seen these movies and pictures who still say "there is no use"... That is just heartcold.

And it's veeeery possible to change the industry.

For an example. In Sweden last year this swedish reporter started to do this inside documentary in two parts (1 hours each) about the down feather indystry that is, just as for fur, AWEFUL! Just like in the fur industry the birds are picked alive (not after death) and they scream. They get big wounds that and just lies for hours after the chock. Veternarians says that alive feather picking is the same as for humans getting their hair/skin picked off. It's really hurtful. And they do this 4-5 times on each bird before they kill it. Just like in the fur industry the animals are being kept in aweful enviroments and tortued til death. The reporter also showed that even if clothes or bed companies promised that their feathers always was picket from dead animals, it was all lies. He actually came around the system and showed that pretty much ALL feathers are picked from alive animals.

When this documentrary was showed swedes got really mad and they revolted against all down feather products. Huge companies like IKEA and Jysk gave money back to all of their costumers. They also changed their profiles since they no longer could say that their feathers for sure was from dead animals.

This got huge in Sweden. The reporter got a really respectful journalist price for his effort and the feather industry really changed over here.

So yes, it's actually possible, might I even say quite easy to change the industry.

At the very least, just to say "I'm against animal torture" you're a good way to change things up.

Btw, for those who didn't know. Sweden is a pretty cold country. Our winters are -30C (-22F). And swedes can do very good without either fur or down feather jackets... So please, don't give me that.

[Chibi-Chan]

Originally Posted by MissElin_

It's such a lame excuse to say that there is no point of being against fur since the industry wont change. That's just a fact for lazy people. I can't think of ANYONE who have seen these movies and pictures who still say "there is no use"... That is just heartcold.

I couldn't agree more.

Originally Posted by MissElin_

And it's veeeery possible to change the industry.

For an example. In Sweden last year this swedish reporter started to do this inside documentary in two parts (1 hours each) about the down feather indystry that is, just as for fur, AWEFUL! Just like in the fur industry the birds are picked alive (not after death) and they scream. They get big wounds that and just lies for hours after the chock. Veternarians says that alive feather picking is the same as for humans getting their hair/skin picked off. It's really hurtful. And they do this 4-5 times on each bird before they kill it. Just like in the fur industry the animals are being kept in aweful enviroments and tortued til death. The reporter also showed that even if clothes or bed companies promised that their feathers always was picket from dead animals, it was all lies. He actually came around the system and showed that pretty much ALL feathers are picked from alive animals.

When this documentrary was showed swedes got really mad and they revolted against all down feather products. Huge companies like IKEA and Jysk gave money back to all of their costumers. They also changed their profiles since they no longer could say that their feathers for sure was from dead animals.

This got huge in Sweden. The reporter got a really respectful journalist price for his effort and the feather industry really changed over here.

So yes, it's actually possible, might I even say quite easy to change the industry.

At the very least, just to say "I'm against animal torture" you're a good way to change things up.

Btw, for those who didn't know. Sweden is a pretty cold country. Our winters are -30C (-22F). And swedes can do very good without either fur or down feather jackets... So please, don't give me that.

Thanks! This example shows perfectly how much power the ones who buy the products could have!

Originally Posted by xLitax

I don't think you really understand...

Even if you want to believe it, THE FUR INDUSTRY WILL NEVER CHANGE. Sorry, but that's the truth. These videos have been around for a long time, which I don't even watch because, come on, do you really think these videos are saying everything true?

Yeah, of course the industry will never change, because people like you like to buy fur. And yeah, of course those videos never show the truth. I think it's a big conspiracy theorie of all the journalists out there who make those videos. They themselve torture those animals to get prices!

Originally Posted by xLitax

I have not given my opinion on if it's right or wrong, because there is no point, especially here in an Ayumi Hamasaki forum.

What comes next? There is no point if it's wrong or right to kill natives in Africa because the industrialized world needs their organs?

And it wasn't me who started this thread. Only because this is an Ayu forum I have to say "Ayu is the goddess and if she likes to wear fur, why not? She looks sooooooooo good and elegant in it!!!!"??????

[Hoshi no Suna]

Can some of you please calm down?
At least have the decency to state your opinion without insulting anyone.
If you wish to change the world, (or the fur industry for that matter), do so at the right place.
This forum is dedicated to Ayumi.

Originally Posted by Chibi-Chan

Yeah, of course the industry will never change, because people like you like to buy fur. And yeah, of course those videos never show the truth. I think it's a big conspiracy theorie of all the journalists out there who make those videos. They themselve torture those animals to get prices!

lol. I don't own fur. Did you not read my post? I never gave my opinion on it. I never said it was okay to wear fur because it will never change. That's putting words in my mouth. I'm just saying stop forcing your opinions on everyone. I'm sorry that you can't handle a cold dose of reality. If you want to change it, do so on a forum that is about that. Because your beliefs on this in this forum, will go no further than this thread.

Originally Posted by Chibi-Chan

What comes next? There is no point if it's wrong or right to kill natives in Africa because the industrialized world needs their organs?

What? Was that even necessary?

[Chibi-Chan]

^I don't get why you don't want to give your opinion on that. Is it because it isn't necessary to you? How could someone say 'I don't care'?

And about forcing my opinion on everyone: This isn't a topic people should have different opinions about. This is not about 'do you like Ayu wearing blue clothes?' or 'do you like L single?'. I don't get all the ignorance for this topic.

[relmy]

I have no problems with Ayu wearing fur. It's her choice, not mine. I would never wear it because I think fur just looks disgusting in clothes, not for any sort of moral reason, I just loath it from a fashion perspective. I don't think anybody has the right to judge another for their opinion on this though, there are definetly huge cultural differences on this issue as other users have pointed out.

There's way to much forcing of opinions in this topic, and making those who like fur out to be bad people, when I'm sure those who are against fur have plenty of beliefs another would condemn them as a bad person for. People disagree, this is not the right place to preach to others. State your own opinion, maybe have a rational discussion, but condemning others for not agreeing with you is wrong.

^...what? =/ You've just said right there nobody is allowed an opinion different from yours.

^^ Do you want to know why? Because I wanted to avoid an argument, which I see has failed. I keep my beliefs to myself on subjects like these, because you see, nobody in the real world cares. What I mean is, you're not going to get anyone to change their opinions on things like these.

And it is an opinion. The title is "how do you feel about Ayu wearing fur?" Some people don't like it, some don't care.

But I'm done arguing about this. It's a sensitive topic~

[Chibi-Chan]

Originally Posted by relmy

^...what? =/ You've just said right there nobody is allowed an opinion different from yours.

Concerning cruelty against animals and human rights I don't accept other opinions.

[hearted]

i dont understand why people wear fur, isnt fake-fur exactly the same (maybe a little bit less softer..)? you help out an animal-life here!
im definetly against it

[koumori]

Originally Posted by Chibi-Chan

Concerning cruelty against animals and human rights I don't accept other opinions.

Seriously, shut up.

Yes, there is cruelty against animals, yes, there is cruelty against humans. Yes, we can change it.

But however, you being a stuck-up idiot on an online forum won't change anything, it just causes arguements.

I faintly understand your point of view but it's quite naive that you think you're going to achieve anything here. If you want to fight for animal rights and change opinions, if you really cared, go and write letters to your country's leaders or organise a group or something - because by being difficult here and trying to change anything here just makes you look annoying.

This thread asked for your opinion on Ayu wearing fur, you have given it, there is no point in posting anymore in this thread.

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by Chibi-Chan

Concerning cruelty against animals and human rights I don't accept other opinions.

So, I invite u to leave this forum dedicated to this ignorant fur using monster that Ayumi Hamasaki is^^