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#101
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^ I see. Lol thanks for the heads up! Fuu has more meanings than what its kanji appears to be. Hahaha
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YAYAYAYA GAGAGAGA DADADADA WOWOWOWO |
#102
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So Beautiful!!!
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#103
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Quote:
Yeah~ I think he just did that for convenience. If you want really direct translation, yeah it's better to put in the so, and only, where it should be. I don't think it really changes the translation. ^^) But you can do it~ for sure. Oh~ I meant. If you use though, you have to put at the beginning. If you use but, you have to put it at the end. That's all~ I think it has same meaning? ?? right??? oo) I found a way you could translate it the way you want. It's a bit tricky, because we forgot to add in the rest of the paragraph. It says tashikani aru. It means it certainly is there. So the sentence is like.. There are certainly nights Where it is setsunai, setsunai, And my chest is tight, but. If you wanna put it your way.. I think I find a way, but it sounds kind of awkward to me. The painful, painful and when my chest is tight nights Are certainly there, but. It doesnt really work. =\ |
#104
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I'd be happy to chop up the sentence a bit if it meant keeping the "order of information" correct, especially matching the repeated word and the general meaning of each line. Like I said before, it just works better when you are following the translation as you listen/watch.
"order of information" is very important to me, for example, the last word of a verse, may be sung with real passion and emotion, being the key word and completing the sentence as it is sung. However, if you are too strict with the translation, the non-japanese speaking person who is looking at their translation will not feel the power of that word, as the translation they are looking at has arranged it "properly", and so the last word in the verse of the english translation is completely different, and the effect is therefore "lost in translation". I hate when that happens. So I prefer to chop a bit, being a little bit flexible with the sentence structure, but maintaining coherence between the japanese song and the corresponding english translation. After all, it is a song, and not just some text. Keeping the feel and power of the song is more important to me than having a perfect translation. The more accurate the translation the better, but the song comes first. - As for this part: I'll have another think...I still want the repetition to go first...
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Last edited by jon_the_d; 7th December 2008 at 07:32 PM. |
#105
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Thanks for your help maikaru. ^^ I understand what was wrong with my other version. Like, she says "chest tightens at night" but I turned it into "chest tightens, it is true at night like that". I see. ^^ Ah well~ I'll leave jon_the_d for chopping it up better so that the repeated word matches. He's from the UK and I'm not even English as first language haha. =p |
#106
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maikaru...
thanks for explaining further... maybe a little tweak to your suggested version might be acceptable: your suggestion: "The painful, painful and when my chest is tight nights Are certainly there, but..." tweaked: Quote:
I'm quite happy with it...any thoughts?
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#107
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And he said like this: "The painful, painful Nights when my chest tightens Are certainly there, but.. etc." Is that okay?? Does that continue to fit that pattern? I understand what you are trying to say.. But also I feel like, even if you translate it the way you want to.. You still lose the feeling. Like you cannot translate setsunai properly into english.. That's why its a bit difficult to express the true and full emotion of songs from different languages who do not have the same origins. I hope you can find that translation you are looking for~ EDIT: jon~ ahaha, so funny. We finally came to the same translation. So I guess its okay!! ^^)/ やっ〜た So I think that's it about the debate~ |
#108
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Oh yea, I like this new translation. ^^
Question though, I didn't know setsunaku te was directed at the nights? @_@ I thought it was just like saying it randomly? Like "feeling so painful, feeling so painful" but without "feeling", so "so painful so painful"? And painful would be >> bittersweet, I think. ^^ |
#109
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Because setsunakute is in adverb connecting mode, It's not really a word by itself. To modify a noun, like.. "The night that is bittersweet and my chest is tight" or "the song that I sing." You simply say the "setsunakute mune ga gyutto naru yoru" setsunakute = the painful AND, <-- the and is so important. Mune ga gyutto naru = my chest becomes tight yoru = night. or "utau uta." utau = to sing uta = song. You put the modifying words first, and then the word to be modified last. that's all~~~ ^^)/ setsunai itself implies a feeling. You don't have to have feeling in the sentence to mean feel. If you say "atashi wa kanashii" You can either mean I feel sad, or I am sad, because they are both the same. That's all~ ^^ |
#110
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lol maikaru!
yes it looks like we've come to the same answer now. although I still don't like the "the", it's not necessary and ruins the repetition, and I used "chest feels so tight" as I thought it sounded better in english, and conveys the feeling more strongly.. and yes, setsunai is still THE major problem....but as we can't translate it well, I'm happy with what we have now. (I will keep thinking about setsunai though)
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#111
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Since there is no word like that one in Japanese, when do you use it in english??? It's so confusing. |
#112
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lol...
the small words are the hardest... (apart from setsunai >.<)
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#113
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Gosh, the "te-form" is so confusing.
maikaru, maybe do you know a website that explains the "te-form"? I tried to look for info, but it always talks about "te + mo" or "-te" to write "please". Do I understand it correctly if: tabete chou = the cake that I eat chou o taberu = I eat the cake Right? If that's true, then.. Wouldn't setsunakute be about mune, the chest? setsunakute mune = the chest that feels painful? Lolllll~confused. >< [Edit] Oh, and another thing~ Quote:
If so, wouldn't it be better if "about it" => "that", and "exchange with me" => "speak to me"? 'Cause exchange would indicate that she's saying things to him too. :S Each word you casually speak to me me Is such a precious treasure to me But I myself feel a bit embarrassed about that So if you knew, you would surely laugh at me Don't you think? Last edited by Melrose; 7th December 2008 at 11:06 PM. |
#115
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(4) Taisetsu na hito ga iru koto wa mou zutto mae kara
Shitte iru yo datte egao ga katatte ru (5) Setsunaku te setsunaku te Mune ga gyu tto naru yoru mo Tashika ni ne aru keredo (6) Kimi o omou sore dake de Kokoro wa ikiru imi o motsu kara Nanika o motomete ru wake ja naku te Tada konna fuu ni itsu made mo Kimi o suki na boku de ite ii desu ka Which stanza do you think the stanza (5) modify, stanza (4) or (6)? I think it modifies both, equally. That's why I prefer to use "though" rather than "but" in this case. |
#116
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melrose, I won't answer your japanese grammar question, although I'm certain that considering the whole sentence, setsunaku te is describing the nights.
but as for your suggestions to the english: "it" I think is ok, "that" wouldn't be used so soon after saying the thing you are referring to....in this case "this" might be best....i.e. "I myself feel embarrassed about this" - casually exchange is definitely the best choice here....mostly because "every word that you casually speak to me" wouldn't normally be used in english, "every word that you casually say to me" sounds better, BUT exchange implies that they are talking to each other, and that it is a two way conversation....it makes sense to me that she would treasure what he said in these conversations, I mean, he's actually talking with her!!!!! not just saying something at her... MOST importantly though, Ayu says so!!! >.< Kawashite translates as "exchange". I'd stick with exchange. ------------------ EDIT: masa, I'm definitely not good at japanese, but in the english, I can't see how the "though" in stanza 5 fits with stanza 4. there's nothing in stanza 4 that would require a "though" in stanza 5. If anything, a "so" would make more sense. making it more of the form 'because of (4), so (5).' or even an "and"... "and it's true I spend...." If you think the keredo modifies both stanzas, maybe to make it work in english will have to use 2 words...one at the start one at the end... using your transaltion we'd get: Quote:
this might not be a direct transaltion, but if you think keredo links 4 to 5 and 5 to 6, then this might be the best way to realise that in english... what do you think?
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Last edited by jon_the_d; 8th December 2008 at 08:53 AM. |
#117
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I don't think so.
(4) I've known for a long time that you have someone precious Because it's clear from your smile This stanza shows that she is rather calm, even knowing that. But the stanza (5) shows she is not calm at all in some nights. So the conjunction must be "though". And I change "it" to "this", taking your advice. Thank you. Last edited by masa; 8th December 2008 at 09:28 AM. |
#118
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I really wonder where ayu pulls all this stuff out of. I've been reminded once more why i love her for her lyrics. This is great stuff. The 17th cannot come sooner.
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#119
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masa, so where are you going to put your "though"?
if you think it modifies/links 4 to 5 and 5 to 6, how are you going to do that in english....? maybe use two "though"s? just using one "though" does not link 4 to 5 AND 5 to 6... - also what makes you think she is calm/not calm in these stanzas? certainly not the way she sings them... They're both negative, so how does 'though' work? it doesn't work in english...
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#120
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No, no. What I mean is the stanza 5 modifies both the stanza 4 and 6.
And as for her state of mind (calm / not calm), all I can say is please read again the romaji and translation of my first post and try to understand it. |
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