[Charts & Rankings] AKB48 surpass Ayu as best selling female Japanese artist

[Trinu]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

You actually think this wasn't company backed from the beginning? And even if it hadn't been, them uploading it amounts to the same thing.

Sure. But they took it down.
Miichan had a rebirth arc after that that wouldn't have been possible had she left.

As for the lyrics thing.
In alk the groups, they have over 1000 songs. Of course they're gonna tap on every issue possible. But to say they promote prostitution? That's a reach. They simply talked about the issue, same as they've used bullying snd suicide.

Again, I'm not defending them in this ranking thing because everybody knows what's what, but they really have great songs out there and I feel people's bias gets in the way of getting to them.

[sakamoko]

I still remember that article against massive selling tricks like AKB48 does:
https://www.japantimes.co.jp/culture...usic-gimmicks/

In fact, since 2015 Oricon doesn't count these releases that includes bonus content in order to avoid inaccurate charts:
http://www.oricon.co.jp/rank/about/

Originally Posted by Oricon

※合算集計対象外となる商品について
・ミュージックカードに代表される、楽曲をダウンロードするためのIDパスワード付カード商品（平成27年 4月6日以降の発売作品より適用）
・コンサートチケットとのセット販売CD（平成27年6月29日以降の発売作品より適用）

※ For items that will not be subject to summing up
· Card products with ID password for downloading music, as typified by music cards (applied from released works since April 6, 2015)
· Set sale CD with concert tickets (applied from released works since June 29, 2015)
(Google Translations)

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by Trinu

Sure. But they took it down.

After massive backlash from the Japanese public.

Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of idol groups that I like and have gotten into over the years, but that doesn't mean the companies aren't in many ways extremely backward and aren't often in line at all with what the current mindset of the general public is; just the mindset of what caters to the otaku audience, who like it or not are what account for the majority of their sales.

It's almost like the company said, "whoops! This isn't okay to do in modern japan any more?? Even the majority of the people in Japan think this?? Oh sorry, didn't realize. Taking it down and will make a note, no more head shaving punishments in the future. Got it."

[njanjayrp]

Originally Posted by Trinu

They didn't make her. She had a breakdown and did it herself.
Management accepting he video and uploading to their YouTube channel was indeed wrong, but nobody asked her to do anything. She could have just left like many others had before.

There was probably a good reason why someone would have a mental breakdown, shave their head and all and I am sure it wasn't the fact that she spent a night with a guy, but rather the pressure geenrated by her record label and wacko fans.

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by njanjayrp

There was probably a good reason why someone would have a mental breakdown, shave their head and all and I am sure it wasn't the fact that she spent a night with a guy, but rather the pressure geenrated by her record label and wacko fans.

Shaving ones head is not really a sign of a mental breakdown in Japan either. It's a form of penance and illustrates their shame for everyone to see. It's been historically a known action for a long, long time. That's why I don't even buy that it was a "mental breakdown", this was a long standing form of attrition. That was her apology for having a boyfriend.

[melissalove]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oP_g3LYUQOw

Even People who usually don't follow jpop thought it to be, horrible what happened to her. :/

[njanjayrp]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

That was her apology for having a boyfriend.

Which isn't something anyone should be apologizing for.

[Trinu]

Originally Posted by himawariii6

Not to mention, some of the lyrics are problematic: promote harassment (Getsuyoubi no Asa, Skirt wo Kirareta by Keyakizaka46) and enjo kosai (sefuku ga jama suru) and some HKT48 song basically said women should focus on pretty and that they were stupid (Einstein yori Dianna Agron)

Let's see.

Keyakizaka's:
http://sakamichidreams.com/2017/07/2...c-translation/

WHERE is it promoting harassment?
It's a song from the POV of a girl being harassed and being depressed in consequence.
Should those topics not be touched in music?

Same goes for AKB's song:
http://stage48.net/studio48/seifukug...ru_single.html

First, the enjo kosai is from the pv, and again, they are not promoting it, just showing ot happens.
The song lyrics are basically about a girl's first 'experience'.

As for HKT's...
http://stage48.net/studio48/einstein...annaagron.html

Saying those lyrics are problematic is the equivalent of
https://sortimid.deviantart.com/art/...tion-662468751

You're basically saying that girls shouldn't worry about their appearance and focus on studying.
Guess what? Some girls don't want to study and that's fine,
Some girls want to be hairdressers and make people look cute and that's fine.

I can't belie I'm arguing this in a jpop forum lol

Their a-sides are basically bubblegum pop because that's how they clicked with the gp (Heavy Rotation boom), but they have so much more:
http://stage48.net/forum/index.php?t...9/#post-891889

[Trinu]

ARAMA is basically anti-idols, so I'm not going not entertain their biased opinions.

The outrage about the HKT song is so ridiculous though.
Like, do you know what playing a character is? Cause that's what they're doing.
They sing that song and the next one will be about stepping on a dog sh*t. Are they promoting stomping on crap? Cause according to your logic, they are.

It's a bad song and it's a mere bside barely performed, so I doubt it's had much impact in Japan's youth.

Again, they have a lot more than songs about being cute.

You’re not as weak as you think
You’ll be able to croos the river of sadness
No matter how hurt and lost you are
I’ll be waiting right here

Unknowingly, unknowingly, we become stronger

http://stage48.net/studio48/anohinojibun.html

EDIT: Leaving my post even if you deleted yours because lol

[njanjayrp]

Originally Posted by Trinu

ARAMA is basically anti-idols, so I'm not going not entertain their biased opinions.

The outrage about the HKT song is so ridiculous though.
Like, do you know what playing a character is? Cause that's what they're doing.
They sing that song and the next one will be about stepping on a dog sh*t. Are they promoting stomping on crap? Cause according to your logic, they are.

It's a bad song and it's a mere bside barely performed, so I doubt it's had much impact in Japan's youth.

Again, they have a lot more than songs about being cute.

You’re not as weak as you think
You’ll be able to croos the river of sadness
No matter how hurt and lost you are
I’ll be waiting right here

Unknowingly, unknowingly, we become stronger

http://stage48.net/studio48/anohinojibun.html

EDIT: Leaving my post even if you deleted yours because lol

If anything I would say Arama is very pro-idol...AKB was never about meaningful lyrics so a random b-side doesn't mean much really. Their image also wasn't built around them as artists who create songs, play instruments and write great lyrics. So whatever you are trying to prove is a bit pointless as they are just an idol group with a great marketing team behind them. Nothing more.

I don't think they are promoting anything though. Just mindlessly selling those cds.

[Diego-kun]

Originally Posted by njanjayrp

If anything I would say Arama is very pro-idol...AKB was never about meaningful lyrics so a random b-side doesn't mean much really. Their image also wasn't built around them as artists who create songs, play instruments and write great lyrics. So whatever you are trying to prove is a bit pointless as they are just an idol group with a great marketing team behind them. Nothing more.

I don't think they are promoting anything though. Just mindlessly selling those cds.

During their first years AKB48's lyrics were one of their differentiating factors from other girl idol groups. Many of their early singles and stage songs are about deep controversial topics such as suicide, sex, bullying, etc. After they started to become more popular and mainstream, those topics were less common.

It's pretty clear they don't sell millions because of their lyrics but you can definitely find good lyrics in 48-46 discography.

[Trinu]

Originally Posted by njanjayrp

If anything I would say Arama is very pro-idol...AKB was never about meaningful lyrics so a random b-side doesn't mean much really. Their image also wasn't built around them as artists who create songs, play instruments and write great lyrics. So whatever you are trying to prove is a bit pointless as they are just an idol group with a great marketing team behind them. Nothing more.

What I man is that they sing whatever Akimoto Yasushi writes for them, and he's quite good at writing lyrics.

It's a bit unfair when people praise songs like
https://youtu.be/_JPKop-dYJ8

but then say this is bad?
https://youtu.be/fgESmgZ4ld8

Both songs' lyrics were written by the very same man, yet one is considered a masterpiece of Japanese music and the other is a throwaway song? That's just bias.

And as Diego said, their first singles (and their stage albums as well) were full of social commentaries, but they didn't catch people's attention with that.
They caught it with Heavy Rotation, and that's why they keep releasing that type of music.

Keyakizaka, on the other hand, debuted with Silent Majority, which resonated a lot with Japanese youth, and they haven't changed their image because they don't need to.

[kendelle]

I feel like people are just using this topic to unfairly rip on AKB now.

You don't have to like them but a whole bunch of these comments are blanket-labeling AKB as just pedo-otaku bait based on their promotional concept (discounting the more serious and interesting lyrics they have). People do the same thing to Ayu's career blanketing her as a desperate has-been trying to stay relevant but we'll point out how they're not looking beyond the surface....

AKB isn't perfect but I think we can discuss this without hypocrisy...obviously time will tell who has the greater impact on popular culture. Japan's music industry would probably need a major overhaul to counteract sales inflation and better represent the general public's thoughts on groups. I still think it's crazy it took so long for AKB to overtake Ayu considering how many copies they can sell. that in itself says a lot about Ayu's legacy.

[SunshineSlayer]

Originally Posted by kendelle

I feel like people are just using this topic to unfairly rip on AKB now.

You don't have to like them but a whole bunch of these comments are blanket-labeling AKB as just pedo-otaku bait based on their promotional concept (discounting the more serious and interesting lyrics they have). People do the same thing to Ayu's career blanketing her as a desperate has-been trying to stay relevant but we'll point out how they're not looking beyond the surface....

I don't care about their lyrics or whatever. That's fine. People who like them, that's fine too.

What bothers me is including them on a sales ranking because I do believe that their sales are illegitimate to a high degree.

[axmish87]

I only know two song from them UZA i Kaze Wa Fuiteiru
Hitomi Shimatani would do wonders with UZA
But oh well. I have nothing against them but this record of theirs is achieved due to the marketing ploy.

[Trinu]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

I don't care about their lyrics or whatever. That's fine. People who like them, that's fine too.

What bothers me is including them on a sales ranking because I do believe that their sales are illegitimate to a high degree.

Blame the game, not the player.

Artists have tricked their way intosales for a while.

Be it with different jackets, different bsides or special editions.

Oricon is aware of all this, hence why they have applied so many restrictions in the sales, but they're still getting those sales.

Tsubasa wa Iranai, for example, sold 1.5 million according to Oricon.
According to Billboard? 2.5.
Sure, it was an election single and people go nuts buying those, but those were still cds sold.

To those surprised that it took them so long, two reasons:
Their first million wasn't until 2010 (5 years after their creation), and Oricon isn't counting everything since a couple of years ago.
They are probably a bit more ahead in copies sold, but whatever.

Again, this record thing is futile anyway.
Everybodyknows how AKB gets their sales, so it should not be taken seriously. But it's also not a reason tobash them when they have over a 1000 songs with plenty of masterpieces scattered around them.

[Chibi-Chan]

Originally Posted by kendelle

I feel like people are just using this topic to unfairly rip on AKB now.

You don't have to like them but a whole bunch of these comments are blanket-labeling AKB as just pedo-otaku bait based on their promotional concept (discounting the more serious and interesting lyrics they have).

Well, they simply are. I'm very sorry for those girls and I won't blame them. If I would have been asked as a twelve year old if I would like to become an idol, I sure as hell would have "agreed". But everyone who is "supporting" them who isn't a teenager anymore should really ask themselves if it's ok to support the abuse of little girls. When those girls become idols they are just children who are then trained to perform in a way so that older men will get a hard on and masturbate to pictures of them. We all know that's true. That's abuse and it's sad that they already have the impact they have.
The whole idol business, Johnny's included, is (sexual) abuse of children and teens and it's well known that those children are also abused by men in the industry on a regular basis.
When I thought it couldn't get any more disgusting, AKB and its sub groups entered the stage and topped everything we have seen before.
Those children are used by one man in order to earn money for him. And as soon as they get too "old" and aren't interesting for pedos anymore, they get thrown away like garbage. They all deserve better.

[DonkeyKongRemix]

I'm not here to be just biased and yell about how Ayu is so much better and AKB48 are nothing compared to her...

...but I just don't understand the appeal of their music. Everything else about them makes sense to me in terms of their popularity...that huge of an idol group, etc. is really actually a cool idea. But man...their music....

[Corvina]

Interesting read:https://www.japantimes.co.jp/culture.../#.Wbzm65_t3qB

[relmy]

Have to admit, I'd grown so used to people...not being positive about Ayu that seeing comments talking fondly of her legacy has been nice.

That's all I've taken from this lol