Has ayu lost her touch?

[emi♡]

I think that's really interesting...I got into Ayu in 2004...but the music I knew was all from 2002...LOVEppears era.

I can totally understand people falling in love with Ayu now, she's the same Ayu. She still has her same "magic", regardless of how I feel about the quality of it.

People have different tastes. Me being elitist, of course I feel the same as others who say the newer fans don't understand about the old music...

but whatever. They don't really have to understand...but we should all still be able to say what we want about how we feel about her music in these threads, without insulting each other and without other people saying we're arguing or having drama, because seriously, it's so 2003 and just like annoying lol

[Zeke.]

^ Yes, when I first heard Ayu it was Depend on you (like I had mentioned) but it was right when Ayu was releasing Moments and I really wanted an Ayu album for Christmas so I read reviews on the albums and me being a big electronic/techno/trance music fan - I decided on LOVEppears. So LOVEppears I played endlessly but MY STORY was the first album that I had been able to witness each prior single being released up until that album.

[bluegie]

Originally Posted by identity

I only became a big fan around 2007 and followed her closely since then, but I've listened to her music years before that. I don't think becoming a fan in 2000 or something would make me witness some sort of "loss of touch" either...

Hmmn... I think it's sorta different. You became her fan in 2007, and since then you keep looking back her older materials. Of course I have no doubt that you know a lot of ayu's stuff (her older songs, lives, magazine scans, interviews, events, etc). Looking through the stuff you can see her changes, and probly to you (and some other newer fans), she does evolve a lot, giving new sounds, getting better voice, etc.

There's something you can't get even when you just read the info tho. That is the experience of following ayu's career at specific time. Let's use A BEST as an example. Probly you know that ayu and hikki released albums on the same day, and you know that it was an extreme event in Japan music history (via interviews, old lives, etc). But you can't get the feeling of being nervous on who's gonna win battle in the end. Since the first day avex made the announcement in January, I remember that I had at least 3 months of mind torturing. I can tell you back then I really wanted hikki to win (cuz I discovered hikki 4 months before ayu). At the same time, I felt soooo bad to see ayu not getting no. 1. And there're lots of things in the mid, like waiting for the release of evolution, NEVER EVER, ayu-mi-x III. Also, the moment of waiting for her single and album's commercials (yes, back then ayu cm are like valuable stuff, such as A BEST cm. I remember that we got excited by seeing a new cm every single day from day 5). I bet most of ayu or hikki (or fans like me who love both) had emotional roller coaster before and after A BEST/Distance release.

What I'm trying to say is that we have been going through her career concurrently. We have witnessed her ups and downs, her dynamic fashion changes. So it's a bit different compared to just looking back without that particular moment's emotion being connected. This is not only applied to you, but to everyone else as well. Let's use me as another example. I'm not a namie follower until probly 2 years ago (can't say myself I'm a truly namie fan because I dun really buy her cds except BEST FICTION). I do know her existence since 1997 (she was much earlier than ayu). I know she was like the biggest artist before her pregnancy, and I did witness her going to the bottom, and climbing back to her current position rite now. I do know what she has released for the past few years, and I see her music direction is fresh. But truly, I dun focus on her so sometimes I dun get the same feeling of what those namie fans talking about even if I look back what she did. And I can tell you that I dun really like namie's older work that much. But the older namie fans may not agree on that.

I'm not trying bring namie out for comparison btw, I just wanna point out myself that I'm an older fan to an artist, but I'm also a newer fan to some other. That's why I understand why we have different feelings toward ayu's recent (or older) releases. Nothing harm.

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

They'll understand when in a couple of years they will long for the days of Next Level.

I hope in a couple of years, I won't long for GUILTY.. cuz I really dun like that album at all... But there's a chance that I may do... lol. I didn't like RAINBOW before, but last time I played the whole album, I found RAINBOW is quite soothing to listen...

Originally Posted by all.night.raver

But, for all fans, you rarely ever feel that "feeling" again. Like, it was something completely new, something fresh. Ayu's music was/is great - but after being a fan so long, it doesn't feel "fresh" anymore. But everyone loves Ayu at different stages and it usually is for about the first year or two that they discover her. Everyone is yearning for "that feeling" again, but it's impossible to get the feeling that one would get when just discovering Ayu. Because then, everything was completely unknown - and now, we form expectations, hopes, wishes...

Hmmn... I sorta agree on that. For example, I used to like CHEMISTRY (the duo). I thought their songs were fabulous, and their voices were great — up till One x One. Since then I found their songs getting more boring, and I lost interest on them eventually (maybe I didn't have enough "love" on them).

There is one exception for me tho.. I haven't got disappointment from hikki yet.. (except probly her fashion sense.. well she doesn't have much since day 1 anywayz)

[ayu_ready?]

^ you're right. I'm fan since A BEST era. so comparing that hectic era and what's been happening for the past 3 years, for example, that what makes me think she lost her touch

[FuNsTyLe]

Originally Posted by mangoo_x3

YOU GUYS SHOULD STOP ARGUING. its a thread where people express THEIR opinion. people may not like yours either, so why start arguing?

Hey relax dude... No one's arguing here. This is actually a really interesting discussion. No argues yet, and people are discussing the subject, and as much as I disagree with some of the posts, we all still love each other... Debates like this one is good to have

[FuNsTyLe]

Originally Posted by identity

I only became a big fan around 2007 and followed her closely since then, but I've listened to her music years before that. I don't think becoming a fan in 2000 or something would make me witness some sort of "loss of touch" either. Now, I've watched every PV/making since 1998, every live performance of hers since then, including all her TV performances, her tours, CDLs, and those ayuready performances/collabs she did. I've also listened to all of her songs in her discography multiple times. I'd think after doing these things I'd notice some sort of "loss of touch" somewhere but I don't - I just see how her, her voice, and her music have changed over the years. (and also how she now knows how to hold a mic correctly when she performs live )

ANYWAY I wasn't saying your prediction is probably wrong, but that it's not necessarily right so you can't really tell someone what they're expecting is most likely wrong. Nobody knows what will happen with the next album, probably not even Ayu yet, so people can expect anything without being wrong at the moment. Hopefully this makes sense lol.

I see your point, yeah it does make sense. But I still think (and I'm not trying to sound arrogant) that I (and other long-term fans) can see quite a change from what it used to be. Not only musically, but her career as a whole, like bluegie stated in the post further up on the page.
She seems almost a bit drowned in her own success, as if she think's it's not necessary to come uyp with new stuff anymore because her fans will love it anyway, so she can just take an old song, make small changes, then it's a new one. Seriously, don't you think her "rock" songs sound very alike? Arrangment, intro, bridges, instruments etc? Compare RULE, 1LOVE, Talkin 2 Myself, GAME, Because of You, Decision... Basically the same song
Or compare Together When, Days, You were, Part of me,

Of course she has some good fresh sounding tracks every now and then, Mirrorcle World and HEAVEN comes to mind. But fresh songs are getting more and more rare in her releases...

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by bluegie

There is one exception for me tho.. I haven't got disappointment from hikki yet.. (except probly her fashion sense.. well she doesn't have much since day 1 anywayz)

Well, Hikki has much less music released than Ayu^^


I know Ayu since 2002, when I became a Hikki fan... Became a casual listener on 2004 and a fan in 2006....

IMO since when I started listening to her (or to both) they have only envolved (if this mean "better" or "worst" music, it depends on who u ask), cuz I can really listen to her older stuff and see where did her recent stuff come from, even when I dislike it^^

[Queen Bee]

Originally Posted by bluegie

Oh my... I think you may create another war -- old ayu fan vs. new ayu fan issue --. I do get what you mean of witnessing the "loss of touch" tho, as I've been her fan since 1999. It's the point of view the newer fans don't understand. This is the same as how we dun really understand why newer fans love her recent works so much. I guess they are attracted by the recent ayu.

Well I've been a fan of Ayu since '99 and I still think she's going great but that's just my personal opinion. I do know of some newer fans that prefer her older work and think she's "lost her touch" with her newer work. So I personally think it really depends on the listener not when they became a fan.

[JinHamasaki]

Originally Posted by SunshineSlayer

^ I'm sure once she announces when the tour will start and once we hear whatever single or album will come out before then, he could do that. (as could probably many other people including myself) That is unless she finally changes things up this year. I basically already laid out how her next concert will be in my above post and if its different from that I will be surprised.

Yeah I agree with Sunshine and ohters about her concerts. Her last invention was ARENA TOUR 2005 ~ MY STORY. I remember being completely in shock watching that concert. It was really fresh.

For example, the GAME/my name's WOMAN stuff was pretty new for her. She never really did "Kick the crap out of men", and when the stage exploded and the curtain dropped was just so shocking and cool. Totally did NOT expect that. The whole fan thing during Moments, and the amazing water works in Boys & Girls really topped it off.

Since then, she's been playing the same tricks. You can predict exactly when the pyrotechnics will occur with pretty much the same outfit. I think Ayu should travel more (and therefore relax) and visit other artists just like some visit her and ideas. She should sightsee more, afterall, the amazing waterworks was from watching the Bellagio water show @ Las Vegas. She's been to Bali so much, she should totally dress the stage as a tropical rainforest paradise and the concert should be a journey through that!

[jbrat2219]

Originally Posted by FuNsTyLe

She seems almost a bit drowned in her own success, as if she think's it's not necessary to come uyp with new stuff anymore because her fans will love it anyway, so she can just take an old song, make small changes, then it's a new one. Seriously, don't you think her "rock" songs sound very alike? Arrangment, intro, bridges, instruments etc? Compare RULE, 1LOVE, Talkin 2 Myself, GAME, Because of You, Decision... Basically the same song
Or compare Together When, Days, You were, Part of me,

Of course she has some good fresh sounding tracks every now and then, Mirrorcle World and HEAVEN comes to mind. But fresh songs are getting more and more rare in her releases...

I may be alone in this but I have to disagree. I don't think Ayu is that disregarding toward her fans. I'm not blind to the fact that many of her songs have a similarity to them but I think it's more her style than just recycled tracks. Each track has a different aura to it, at least to me. I get different feelings from each song.

For example: Rule and 1 LOVE I get a sense of sass with these songs. Kind of like, "you're not going to tell me what the **** to do, I know what I want and I know how to get it." A sense of confidence if you will. With Because of you, I feel a sense of angst in a way. From the arrangement of the song, to the lyrics to the PV. But from the song itself I don't find it very similar to the other ones. GAME I always felt was a pop-rock song, she even threw in very small hints of techno and voice distortion (which I remember thinking it was the first time I heard her use that when the song came out. More so than in evolution at least). With talkin' 2 myself and decision I feel a sense of aggression. Those songs are specifically harder than her typical rock tracks and she also mixed it strings to add that extra flare of determination. talkin' 2 myself particularly sounded like the world was gonna end to me .

Anyway I'm not going to get into the ballads you've mentioned because hopefully you see my point lol. The song compositions may be similar, the arrangements (of course if it's rock it's going to have guitars so...) may be similar, etc., but to me, in my honest opinion, the songs are not the same. They don't have the same aura to me. Same with her ballads. Although some songs do project the same aura (summer songs for example). But maybe that just means she's at that same place again?

I dunno, sorry for the longevity of this post lol. But I don't feel like Ayu is just recycling her songs as many seem to think. Possibly because I look at the songs based on the era in which they were written and not necessarily the individual songs themselves.

[bluegie]

^ I think arrangement is the main factor to kill off many fans' interest (referring to us who think her songs are recycled). Also, I think to a point she has written tooooo many songs, and reading through translations I just saw some repetitive themes. To be honest I've stopped reading her lyric translations since 2007. Of course even the most precise translation can't really reflect the structural and word play of Japanese. I read both English and Chinese (a closer language to Japanese compared to English) translation and there are a lot of deja vu to me.

It would be kinda extreme to say she's drowned to her success (probly she is, but I'm not sure), but indeed at this moment she's satisfied, staying at the same place. Like you said, Rule or 1 LOVE or Because of you may not sound the same, but the structural arrangement are practically similar: verse, chorus, verse, chorus, bridge music, chorus, a stronger chorus, end. I hope sometimes she can change that format (e.g., SURREAL: v, v, b, c... HEAVEN: v, bridge, c, c). And there's something bugging me.. when she has a success to a song, there may be a clone coming out the following year. M vs. Free & Easy is a good example to her earlier career. Recent... Because of you theme is quite similar to GAME (even tho different in lyrics). Her summer attacks (fairyland --> BB --> glitter), etc.

Oh I drag myself too far away from the topic....

Originally Posted by Ayumi626

Well I've been a fan of Ayu since '99 and I still think she's going great but that's just my personal opinion. I do know of some newer fans that prefer her older work and think she's "lost her touch" with her newer work. So I personally think it really depends on the listener not when they became a fan.

Yes I know some older fans prefer her new music. There's no absolute that all older fans will share the same views (oh and newer fans as well). But it's nice to see who shares similar feelings, and it's interesting to see what other fans think.

[love in music]

Originally Posted by jbrat2219

I may be alone in this but I have to disagree. I don't think Ayu is that disregarding toward her fans. I'm not blind to the fact that many of her songs have a similarity to them but I think it's more her style than just recycled tracks. Each track has a different aura to it, at least to me. I get different feelings from each song.

For example: Rule and 1 LOVE I get a sense of sass with these songs. Kind of like, "you're not going to tell me what the **** to do, I know what I want and I know how to get it." A sense of confidence if you will. With Because of you, I feel a sense of angst in a way. From the arrangement of the song, to the lyrics to the PV. But from the song itself I don't find it very similar to the other ones. GAME I always felt was a pop-rock song, she even threw in very small hints of techno and voice distortion (which I remember thinking it was the first time I heard her use that when the song came out. More so than in evolution at least). With talkin' 2 myself and decision I feel a sense of aggression. Those songs are specifically harder than her typical rock tracks and she also mixed it strings to add that extra flare of determination. talkin' 2 myself particularly sounded like the world was gonna end to me .

Anyway I'm not going to get into the ballads you've mentioned because hopefully you see my point lol. The song compositions may be similar, the arrangements (of course if it's rock it's going to have guitars so...) may be similar, etc., but to me, in my honest opinion, the songs are not the same. They don't have the same aura to me. Same with her ballads. Although some songs do project the same aura (summer songs for example). But maybe that just means she's at that same place again?

I dunno, sorry for the longevity of this post lol. But I don't feel like Ayu is just recycling her songs as many seem to think. Possibly because I look at the songs based on the era in which they were written and not necessarily the individual songs themselves.

omg, this so much. All of these words could have come from me, I agree w/everything.

[Queen Bee]

Originally Posted by bluegie

Yes I know some older fans prefer her new music. There's no absolute that all older fans will share the same views (oh and newer fans as well). But it's nice to see who shares similar feelings, and it's interesting to see what other fans think.

What you said is very true. I always like to see what others think even if it's a different opinion than mine. It creates a more interesting dialog between fans as long as both sides are respected by the other.

[taskinillusion]

Originally Posted by all.night.raver

I was really thinking hard about this issue a while ago but was too lazy to post a discussion topic about it.

I feel like, Ayu's best work for me is MY STORY (Moments, About you, my name's WOMEN, GAME) and STEP you/is this LOVE? - coincidentally, I discovered Ayu's "Depend on you" first, but it was right around the time that Moments was being released as a single. I love her work then. But, for all fans, you rarely ever feel that "feeling" again. Like, it was something completely new, something fresh. Ayu's music was/is great - but after being a fan so long, it doesn't feel "fresh" anymore. But everyone loves Ayu at different stages and it usually is for about the first year or two that they discover her. Everyone is yearning for "that feeling" again, but it's impossible to get the feeling that one would get when just discovering Ayu. Because then, everything was completely unknown - and now, we form expectations, hopes, wishes...

YES! Yes, yes, yes, a million times, YES! This is exactly the way I feel put into words. Thank you for expressing that so wonderfully.

Originally Posted by jbrat2219

I may be alone in this but I have to disagree. I don't think Ayu is that disregarding toward her fans. I'm not blind to the fact that many of her songs have a similarity to them but I think it's more her style than just recycled tracks. Each track has a different aura to it, at least to me. I get different feelings from each song.

For example: Rule and 1 LOVE I get a sense of sass with these songs. Kind of like, "you're not going to tell me what the **** to do, I know what I want and I know how to get it." A sense of confidence if you will. With Because of you, I feel a sense of angst in a way. From the arrangement of the song, to the lyrics to the PV. But from the song itself I don't find it very similar to the other ones. GAME I always felt was a pop-rock song, she even threw in very small hints of techno and voice distortion (which I remember thinking it was the first time I heard her use that when the song came out. More so than in evolution at least). With talkin' 2 myself and decision I feel a sense of aggression. Those songs are specifically harder than her typical rock tracks and she also mixed it strings to add that extra flare of determination. talkin' 2 myself particularly sounded like the world was gonna end to me .

Anyway I'm not going to get into the ballads you've mentioned because hopefully you see my point lol. The song compositions may be similar, the arrangements (of course if it's rock it's going to have guitars so...) may be similar, etc., but to me, in my honest opinion, the songs are not the same. They don't have the same aura to me. Same with her ballads. Although some songs do project the same aura (summer songs for example). But maybe that just means she's at that same place again?

I dunno, sorry for the longevity of this post lol. But I don't feel like Ayu is just recycling her songs as many seem to think. Possibly because I look at the songs based on the era in which they were written and not necessarily the individual songs themselves.

EXACTLY!!! Ayu has a style with what she does that makes it... well, Ayu! Thank you for this too. It explains what a lot of people feel.

[Coelacanth]

Originally Posted by FuNsTyLe

I see your point, yeah it does make sense. But I still think (and I'm not trying to sound arrogant) that I (and other long-term fans) can see quite a change from what it used to be. Not only musically, but her career as a whole, like bluegie stated in the post further up on the page.
She seems almost a bit drowned in her own success, as if she think's it's not necessary to come uyp with new stuff anymore because her fans will love it anyway, so she can just take an old song, make small changes, then it's a new one. Seriously, don't you think her "rock" songs sound very alike? Arrangment, intro, bridges, instruments etc? Compare RULE, 1LOVE, Talkin 2 Myself, GAME, Because of You, Decision... Basically the same song
Or compare Together When, Days, You were, Part of me,

Of course she has some good fresh sounding tracks every now and then, Mirrorcle World and HEAVEN comes to mind. But fresh songs are getting more and more rare in her releases...

In all fairness though, you could say a lot of her older songs sound the same too. However, I think the songs that sounded similar were confined to one album/era. The thing with the "rock" songs is I think they're all interchangeable and not really defining of any certain era/album. You could put "Rule" on Secret and "1 LOVE" on NEXT LEVEL and they wouldn't feel out of place. It's her sound, really.. There's a lack of progression.

My friend who generally doesn't like JPOP but likes Ayu thinks her old stuff is really bad, even when I say LOVEppears and Duty are her absolute best albums. He said those albums all sound like one extended song, which you know.. I can see his point in some ways. But personally, I loved when her albums were more cohesive. I think it began with MY STORY when she insisted on creating albums with like 5 different genres.

I think we really have to take lyrics into consideration. I'm sure Ayu's initial success didn't have much to do with her sound. ASFXX and LOVEppears were hardly revolutionary in terms of genre. especially ASFXX which sounded dated even at the time of its release! Whether all her rock songs sound alike or not, they still all have different lyrics. And what is Ayu better known for than her lyrics?

[gothicayu]

i also felt like she lost it ( between the vocal , the creativity for the cotums or the scene that we have seen over and over again )
and its not only this year but i felt it few years ago ...

her voice also changed and there is some of her own songs that don't suit her anymore ...

i have to say my story live must have been one of her best .

the only thing that's original in her concert are those " mini pv story " that i love . i wish they had longer version in the bonus dvd .

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by Coelacanth

In all fairness though, you could say a lot of her older songs sound the same too. However, I think the songs that sounded similar were confined to one album/era. The thing with the "rock" songs is I think they're all interchangeable and not really defining of any certain era/album. You could put "Rule" on Secret and "1 LOVE" on NEXT LEVEL and they wouldn't feel out of place. It's her sound, really.. There's a lack of progression.

My friend who generally doesn't like JPOP but likes Ayu thinks her old stuff is really bad, even when I say LOVEppears and Duty are her absolute best albums. He said those albums all sound like one extended song, which you know.. I can see his point in some ways. But personally, I loved when her albums were more cohesive. I think it began with MY STORY when she insisted on creating albums with like 5 different genres.

I think we really have to take lyrics into consideration. I'm sure Ayu's initial success didn't have much to do with her sound. ASFXX and LOVEppears were hardly revolutionary in terms of genre. especially ASFXX which sounded dated even at the time of its release! Whether all her rock songs sound alike or not, they still all have different lyrics. And what is Ayu better known for than her lyrics?

Sorry, but her rockish songs have different rock genres influences... while 1Love and Until that day... (Secret era) are based on hard rock, T2m, decision and Marionette are more likelly inspired on symphonic metal (Guilty era) for example. Even if I don't really know the name of the rock genre on songs like Because of You, Game, is this love?, etc, they don't sound like something based on the same rock genre.

BTW, NL is one of her most cohesive albums IMO... besides I am..., Secret, Duty (yeah, Duty), Memorial Address and My Story IMO all of her albums show a particular direction

[GRACE]

Originally Posted by Andrenekoi

Sorry, but her rockish songs have different rock genres influences... while 1Love and Until that day... (Secret era) are based on hard rock, T2m, decision and Marionette are more likelly inspired on symphonic metal (Guilty era) for example. Even if I don't really know the name of the rock genre on songs like Because of You, Game, is this love?, etc, they don't sound like something based on the same rock genre.

BTW, NL is one of her most cohesive albums IMO... besides I am..., Secret, Duty (yeah, Duty), Memorial Address and My Story IMO all of her albums show a particular direction

That's why rollin' goes right into GREEN

[Ayu_no_tenshi]

i agree 100% with both GRACE and Ayumi626. i would especially like to elaborate on the the statement from Ayumi626 about us (the fans). in the early part of her career, it was more about 'me me me'. singing was her escape and her way of confronting her issues and healing herself or even coming to realize something that she hadn't really known before. she's even said that she was writing for herself and trying to find her place in the world. it was all about discovering herself. then she got to a period to where things were great. she had her newly found success and her wonderful relationship and she started to change. i honestly think that's when she looked at her life and thought "wow...after all i've been through and the darkness i experienced, my fans were always there for me" and that caused her to be more conscious of us and what we want or things that we might be going through. these days, it's almost like she shoves her needs aside in order to please us. she's said several times in interviews that she feels in this day and age, it's her duty to deliver messages of hope to lift people up, keep them strong and help them go on. i can't think of any other artist out there that is as closely connected to their fans as ayu. eastern or western. while this is wonderful and it's definitely one of the things we've all come to love about ayu...it certainly doesn't help her out as much as it does for us. don't you think that we, as fans, have been a little too selfish and way too demanding of her? of course there are some of us out there that wish she'd take a break but i remember when she hurt her hand and almost canceled PCDL. a lot of people were furious. that's insane, if you ask me. her health and well-being should be our main concern. same goes for the voice complaints. i consider myself an extremely devoted ayu fan but i will be the first to admit that her voice has been off and weak lately in her live performances but that doesn't anger me and it doesn't make me upset with her. it certainly doesn't make me like her any less. what it does do, however, is make me worry. i'm really concerned about what's going on in her life. she's had a LOT of bad things happen over the course of the past two years and just as Ayumi626 said...she hasn't really allowed herself time to really think about those things and heal. she just always bounces back immediately with that "GOTTA GO ON!" kind of attitude so that we are not disappointed in her. we sit back and admire her for that and think "wow, she's so strong!" but really we need to know that it's ok to be weak sometimes. she's sacrificed a lot for the sake of her fans. she has all this bottled-up pain and it's completely thrown her off. everyone has their ups and downs. i truly believe that this is just a slump for her and she will get through it eventually. i have a feeling that the next album, or possibly the one after that, is going to be super amazing because everything that's building up inside of her right now is going to overflow or explode and she's gonna finally release all of her emotions and focus on healing herself again. she really needs to take it easy. anyway, as we all know...she just recently wrote and released a song specifically for US. "RED LINE ~for TA~" has some of the most beautiful and touching lyrics. it's all about offering us strength and hope. she's always there for us...how about we be there for her for a change??

[Andrenekoi]

Originally Posted by GRACE

That's why rollin' goes right into GREEN

That's why a song about the needing of changing goes right into a totally different one =)