[Charts & Rankings] The Official Oricon Thread ~again~

[lightningrod]

Originally Posted by Zeke.

I find it ridiculous that people here on this forum are still in denial over the current state of her career. Regardless whether or not you think this 'scandal' is a huge deal or not, it is in Japan. We have heard people dropping out of TeamAyu. We have seen statements made by Ayu herself regarding her current state of affairs. We have seen comments posted about her FNS performance. We have heard countless accounts of people on this forum who have talked to Japanese fans (even IN JAPAN) who all have been saying the same thing. The general consensus is that she is in some big trouble... Wake up and smell the coffee... It's an ugly truth, but it's a truth.

LOVE
1st Day
Position: #3
Sales: 21,743

2nd Day
Position: #3
Sales: 16,629

Total Sales: 38,372

again
1st Day
Position: #4
Sales: 9,087

2nd Day
Position: #2
Sales: 12,764
Total Sales: 21,851

Even the argument on "people are confused by the release date" is invalid.

I blame its cover and PVs featuring Maro, it's PQ all over again. Most of Japanese and Chinese fans are hating him. I had some negative feelings towards ayu, too. But then I realized that her music is still the same good and that's reason enough to support her.

Originally Posted by harufi

Yeah the drop was too sharp for first day sales for 'again', its a shame really -
she puts out songs that i'm sure her Japanese fanbase would eat up and love, and they're overlooking it because she's dating someone.

I don't think it's DATING someone made her fans angry but DRAGGING him into the cover and PVs, esp when she knew that they hate him.

[relmy]

^I think it's more to do with Ayu's insistence that her personal is separate to her public, and well... it's not.

By personal, I don't mean her introverted lyrics and emotions in songs - I mean Last Angel, Love Song, snowy kiss. Loads of artists have emotional and VERY personal lyrics (more so than Ayu), but still keep their private life out of the press, media and their work.

And, I'm sorry, but if you DON'T want your life all over the media, you can stop it - even if it costs $$$$. People do it. But being in the media for your personal life is the life blood of a pop star though, it can make and break you if you take the risk of using it.

When all else fails, keep your name on peoples lips by the press spinning stories about your latest man/woman. Cynical? Maybe. It won't shift CDs, but at least people still know your name.

I don't think Ayu wants her time to be over, even though she may love music now (I think in her early days she loved the fame more), these are the last ditch attempts to stay as "Ayumi Hamasaki". When really, if a few things hadn't happened, people maybe wouldn't have bought her CDs or liked her music, but she wouldn't have cracked the reputation of "Ayumi Hamasaki" from her peak.

It's such a typical trajectory that... well... what else is to be expected?

[My Rainbow]

Originally Posted by lightningrod

I blame its cover and PVs featuring Maro, it's PQ all over again. Most of Japanese and Chinese fans are hating him. I had some negative feelings towards ayu, too. But then I realized that her music is still the same good and that's reason enough to support her.



I don't think it's DATING someone made her fans angry but DRAGGING him into the cover and PVs, esp when she knew that they hate him.

Why people have to hate Maro? I don't get it!

I'm a Madonna fan, but what the hell... if I had to hate her everytime she changes boyfriend...

I don't see Maro interfering in Ayu's work. She wanted to use a model for her covers, why it cannot be him? what if she wants to be half naked in Party queen? Are you all that SHALLOW? Grow up!

Less HATE and more LOVE people...

[lightningrod]

Originally Posted by My Rainbow

Why people have to hate Maro? I don't get it!

I'm a Madonna fan, but what the hell... if I had to hate her everytime she changes boyfriend...

I don't see Maro interfering in Ayu's work. She wanted to use a model for her covers, why it cannot be him? what if she wants to be half naked in Party queen? Are you all that SHALLOW? Grow up!

Less HATE and more LOVE people...

I don't know where you are from or whether you're familiar with Asian cultures, but here in China and I learned that it's similar in Japan, people generally don't have a good opinion about divorced people, and they tend to frown upon relationships where the female is older than the male. Asian fans don't hate Mannie (maybe some of them can't get over the fact that ayu didn't choose a Japanese but that's not hate) but they hate Maro because he is a) divorced and probably had a child and b) he is six years younger than ayu. Many fans automatically turned to "Maro must've been taking advantage of ayu"

Personally I don't mind she had her half ass on her album cover but Japanese may accept that from Kuu but certainly not ayu, I blame this cover on lowering ayu's sales. If you don't believe this, consider these statistics:
debut week sales:
NL: 24k
R'n'RC: 20k, dropped by 16%
Ls: 18k, dropped by 10%
FIVE: 12.7k, dropped by 29%
PQ: 9.7k, dropped by 25%

Now keep in mind that FIVE is an EP, so PQ dropped almost half from Ls debut week sales, and that's huge

And speaking of shallow, who isn't really? Even ayu is shallow enough to think that western people and everything about them is better than her own race, why do you think she used much more Caucasian actors in her PVs than Japanese? And why do you think that she loves the US so much that she almost moved there?

[My Rainbow]

i understand the cultural differences, but i think it is still OVERREACTED.

[YuriChan]

Originally Posted by lightningrod

I don't know where you are from or whether you're familiar with Asian cultures, but here in China and I learned that it's similar in Japan, people generally don't have a good opinion about divorced people, and they tend to frown upon relationships where the female is older than the male. Asian fans don't hate Mannie (maybe some of them can't get over the fact that ayu didn't choose a Japanese but that's not hate) but they hate Maro because he is a) divorced and probably had a child and b) he is six years younger than ayu. Many fans automatically turned to "Maro must've been taking advantage of ayu"

Funny you should say that... But didn't the overseas fan say the same thing about Mannie taking advantage of ayu? I mean, I understand why ayu dating Maro isn't acceptable in Asian culture. But with ayu and Mannie, she was also the older one in the relationship. To be honest, it's also ironic, given the circumstances.

[lightningrod]

Originally Posted by YuriChan

Funny you should say that... But didn't the overseas fan say the same thing about Mannie taking advantage of ayu? I mean, I understand why ayu dating Maro isn't acceptable in Asian culture. But with ayu and Mannie, she was also the older one in the relationship. To be honest, it's also ironic, given the circumstances.

I didn't remember reading on AHS or anywhere about that, and I assume that age gap wasn't as great as six, and the most important thing is: Mannie wasn't divorced.

Originally Posted by My Rainbow

i understand the cultural differences, but i think it is still OVERREACTED.

I still have the opinion that if she's just dating Maro and didn't drag him into the again covers and PVs, the sales would've been better

And a majority of music buyers are that shallow, how many people are buying music just because of the singer/group's physical attractiveness? AKB48 sells CDs that incredibly by offering a handshake coupon to those who buy 50 copies of one album/single

[TeamAyu2004]

just...



thats all.

[ayu_ready?]

Originally Posted by YuriChan

I think she needs to take a small hiatus and do some soul searching. Then, she can come back with something amazing!! But, knowing ayu, I don't know if she'll even consider something like that.

okay, Ayu should go to Tibet and sing there songs with Alan so they can both come back mega inspired later

[yukito]

Bla bla bla, always the same drama every time ayu does not reach number 1, so what? Her music has been going stale since Rock 'n' Roll Circus, so what is the big shock here? I know a lot of people do not agree but to me it feels that way. Do I still care about ayumi? As far as the new releases go not so much, regarding the quality of music that is, now looking back, yes, I still love her lots, the old days feel the same for me and I listen to her probably still everyday.

The thing is people have different ways to see the world, so there will always be people that will continue to love everything, and those who will just stop caring, but maybe after a while she will do something good again, at least I hope so.

[YuriChan]

Originally Posted by yukito

Bla bla bla, always the same drama every time ayu does not reach number 1, so what? Her music has been going stale since Rock 'n' Roll Circus, so what is the big shock here? I know a lot of people do not agree but to me it feels that way. Do I still care about ayumi? As far as the new releases go not so much, regarding the quality of music that is, now looking back, yes, I still love her lots, the old days feel the same for me and I listen to her probably still everyday.

The thing is people have different ways to see the world, so there will always be people that will continue to love everything, and those who will just stop caring, but maybe after a while she will do something good again, at least I hope so.

As much as it pains me to say this (and I love ayu to death), but I agree with you. Her music has been kind of bland since Rock 'n' Roll Circus.

[TeamAyu2004]

^ I think the complete opposite...
When Rock n ROll circus came out, I had had it with her... the disappointing that was guilty, I didnt even want to give Next Level a try and then RnR... please...
thank god Love Songs came around or I might not be a fan today.

[harufi]

Originally Posted by relmy

^I think it's more to do with Ayu's insistence that her personal is separate to her public, and well... it's not.

By personal, I don't mean her introverted lyrics and emotions in songs - I mean Last Angel, Love Song, snowy kiss. Loads of artists have emotional and VERY personal lyrics (more so than Ayu), but still keep their private life out of the press, media and their work.

And, I'm sorry, but if you DON'T want your life all over the media, you can stop it - even if it costs $$$$. People do it. But being in the media for your personal life is the life blood of a pop star though, it can make and break you if you take the risk of using it.

When all else fails, keep your name on peoples lips by the press spinning stories about your latest man/woman. Cynical? Maybe. It won't shift CDs, but at least people still know your name.

I don't think Ayu wants her time to be over, even though she may love music now (I think in her early days she loved the fame more), these are the last ditch attempts to stay as "Ayumi Hamasaki". When really, if a few things hadn't happened, people maybe wouldn't have bought her CDs or liked her music, but she wouldn't have cracked the reputation of "Ayumi Hamasaki" from her peak.

It's such a typical trajectory that... well... what else is to be expected?

I guess I can agree with that upsetting fans, its just painful to see it affect sales to this extreme

How many copies do you guys think 'again' will shift in the long-run? (as in, before it drops off the charts)
I think about 60k, though I'm keeping fingers crossed both this and LOVE can sell 100k

Originally Posted by yukito

Bla bla bla, always the same drama every time ayu does not reach number 1, so what? Her music has been going stale since Rock 'n' Roll Circus, so what is the big shock here? I know a lot of people do not agree but to me it feels that way. Do I still care about ayumi? As far as the new releases go not so much, regarding the quality of music that is, now looking back, yes, I still love her lots, the old days feel the same for me and I listen to her probably still everyday.

The thing is people have different ways to see the world, so there will always be people that will continue to love everything, and those who will just stop caring, but maybe after a while she will do something good again, at least I hope so.

I think the problem with Love songs was that pretty much everything was medium-tempo and there are strings ****ing everywhere. That said, I think it made the album more cohesive than R'n'RC, though I can understand how it could be seen as a bland record because it has the same sound the whole way through. I can't really see how anything past Love songs can be seen as bland or stale though, apart from beloved (dull & unnecessary) on FIVE, hyba (and maybe call and letter) from PQ, Melody (although i really enjoy it) from LOVE and Ivy from again.
For me, Ayu has tried a bit of everything since R'n'RC (and has definitely not had stale music this year lol).

[YuriChan]

Originally Posted by TeamAyu2004

^ I think the complete opposite...
When Rock n ROll circus came out, I had had it with her... the disappointing that was guilty, I didnt even want to give Next Level a try and then RnR... please...
thank god Love Songs came around or I might not be a fan today.

I think NEXT LEVEL is an amazing album! <3 But again, that's just me.

[yukito]

Originally Posted by YuriChan

I think NEXT LEVEL is an amazing album! <3 But again, that's just me.

I'm with you as well, the only track I can't bring myself to listen to is Curtain Call, dam that song just bores the hell out of me and the very beggining of the song makes me think I'm actually going to listen to Mariah's Without You...

[TeamAyu2004]

Originally Posted by YuriChan

I think NEXT LEVEL is an amazing album! <3 But again, that's just me.

it is... what I meant was that I was SO disappointed with Guilty, that I didnt even give it a chance, and then when RnR came out... i was like:

but Im happy now... this reminds me of ayumi's golden age... everything is just grand for me.

[Bigtop]

Taking a closer look at the top ten...

Originally Posted by KarenPang

Oricon Weekly - Albums (3/12/2012~9/12/2012)

*1 382,217 382,217 EXILE - EXILE BEST HITS -LOVE SIDE/SOUL SIDE-
*2 116,712 116,712 YUI - GREEN GARDEN POP
*3 115,943 115,943 YUI - ORANGE GARDEN POP
*4 *82,272 612,507 Mr.Children - [(an imitation) blood orange]
*5 *74,419 549,541 Matsutoya Yumi - Matsutoya Yumi 40 Shunen Kinen Best Album Nihon no Koi to, Yuming to。
*6 *45,910 *45,910 BIGBANG - SPECIAL FINAL IN DOME MEMORIAL COLLECTION
*7 *34,402 *34,402 Hamasaki Ayumi - again
*8 *24,296 141,259 Shoujo Jidai - GIRLS' GENERATION II ~Girls & Peace~
*9 *18,092 *18,092 HY - Route29
10 *17,442 847,671 Arashi - Popcorn

(she's in between Korean idol acts, if you're wondering)

No surprise that EXILE, YUI and Mr.Children outsold them (Mr.Children on their second week?). Even Yumi Matsutoya. Anyone shocked at the numbers or not?

[Max_ZZZ]

i just hope one day she has a namie amuro and comes back. if she pulls it together she deserves it!

[orbitalaspect]

Originally Posted by TeamAyu2004

^ just going by the tend it could have easily hit 60K for the week.

also this is just the first half week for the mini, we dont know the final says yet.

A "half-week" is 3.5 days. There were only 2 days of non-sales for her. I will definitely agree that she got the butt end of the stick here by releasing almost half-way through the week. Most Japanese will hit the record store on the first day of new releases and buy up what they want. She missed out on that with again.

Originally Posted by TeamAyu2004

^ also where did you get your numbers since oricon hasn't posted their official week yet?

By the way, again hit number 6 in the charts for Monday, so it went UP 4 slots.

Releases always have a bit of springboard after the first week. The day is the day for new releases, so more people go out to the stores and are likely to pick up whatever they may have wanted to grab. :|

Originally Posted by Zeke.

I find it ridiculous that people here on this forum are still in denial over the current state of her career. Regardless whether or not you think this 'scandal' is a huge deal or not, it is in Japan. We have heard people dropping out of TeamAyu. We have seen statements made by Ayu herself regarding her current state of affairs. We have seen comments posted about her FNS performance. We have heard countless accounts of people on this forum who have talked to Japanese fans (even IN JAPAN) who all have been saying the same thing. The general consensus is that she is in some big trouble... Wake up and smell the coffee... It's an ugly truth, but it's a truth.

LOVE
1st Day
Position: #3
Sales: 21,743

2nd Day
Position: #3
Sales: 16,629

Total Sales: 38,372

again
1st Day
Position: #4
Sales: 9,087

2nd Day
Position: #2
Sales: 12,764
Total Sa

Even the argument on "people are confused by the release date" is invalid.

No kidding. And I support you 110% here. It's stupid that people on this forum are acting like we're shallow and judgmental because we're calling out the fact that the quality of Ayu's career has so noticeably diminished that she can barely get a Top 5 release now. And I don't buy for a damn second that it's because she's old. Namie can still sell 2X Platinum on an album, and it's because she made a decision to step up her game as an artist. Why Ayu is acting like it doesn't matter if she tries is completely beyond me.

Originally Posted by emi♡

You know, I just hear you ***** ***** ***** all over the place...and that's all you do.


What would you propose for her?

In the end, if it WAS all a publicity thing, obviously a ****** one, then hopefully, they'll abandon all their strategic ways of getting her more sales, cause they're obviously not working.

I propose Ayumi go back to the drawing table and figure out how she can make her career more interesting for her, and therefore more appealing to us. We've always been fans of Ayu herself, and yes, we love her music, but we're stupidly confused as to why she keeps driving around thinking this flat tire of a career she has now will get her car down the street of success.

Originally Posted by saigodansu

I find Emi's perspective on this to be like 90% of AHS. "Ayu would never lie to us, she said so. Therefore this has to be real because she never lies to her fans." It's getting very old, very stupid and with how many fans base it off her old NHK interviews, while parts of those are noticably staged for the press and the fans, it makes you seem incapable of intelligent thought. Try thinking for yourselves instead of believing everything Avex wants you to believe. Atleast the japanese fans are finally pulling off the blinders and quit buying their garbage. These stunts should and hopefully will tank her career. Her career should be based on her talent not a bunch of gimmicks, lies and publicity stunts. When allowed to show it, she's got more talent than Madonna, Britney, Gaga, Namie, Hikki and Kuu put together. So try supporting her and not buy anything Avex has their name attached to. Buy what comes from Ayumi after she drops Avex like a bad habit and relies on her talent again.

I honestly don't think this is all Avex. I think Ayumi doesn't care as much as she used to. Maybe that's where she is now... maybe that's why she is trying so hard to find a man she feels will fill some void in her lonely life. However, I can't say that this is all Avex. They aren't ****ing up that much with every other artist, so I doubt that Ayu is just sitting in the background saying, "I can't be an artist anymore!" like what happened with A BEST.

Originally Posted by jang-kun

It's pretty ironic, isn't it? It was the people who created a mega monster star like her. They shared the very limelight Ayu achieved during her prime, mainly by being a fan and screaming her name and buying her CDs. She have done everything for everyone. She made her fans proud, spoiled to a further extent, of consecutive and sometimes spontaneous #1 hits here and there. We developed confidence every time Ayu will be releasing something. "Ayu is, as usual, slaying the charts." For some fans, whatever she touches becomes gold. She was even touted the "Empress of Pop." However, reality had stricken. She's no more. She's no longer there. She's no longer the slayer she used to be. These thoughts, whatever they mean to anyone, doesn't really bother me. What bothers me is the day when Ayu decided to stop music. She knows she can't please anyone, I believe that. But what if she realized no one is left to support her? I sincerely hope that day won't come.

Pardon the drama, but the current situation: the way Japan looks at her, the way overseas fans treat her, and the way she is right now, it really makes me sad. If things would only get worse if she decided to continue, I rather wish she'd take a hiatus after her 15th anniversary. It's really weakening seeing a once mighty star falling down slowly and painfully from the heavens just like that.

sigh

It is painful. But just like Namie, maybe Ayumi has to hit the bottom before she can see a way back up?

Originally Posted by lightningrod

I don't know where you are from or whether you're familiar with Asian cultures, but here in China and I learned that it's similar in Japan, people generally don't have a good opinion about divorced people, and they tend to frown upon relationships where the female is older than the male. Asian fans don't hate Mannie (maybe some of them can't get over the fact that ayu didn't choose a Japanese but that's not hate) but they hate Maro because he is a) divorced and probably had a child and b) he is six years younger than ayu. Many fans automatically turned to "Maro must've been taking advantage of ayu"

Personally I don't mind she had her half ass on her album cover but Japanese may accept that from Kuu but certainly not ayu, I blame this cover on lowering ayu's sales. If you don't believe this, consider these statistics:
debut week sales:
NL: 24k
R'n'RC: 20k, dropped by 16%
Ls: 18k, dropped by 10%
FIVE: 12.7k, dropped by 29%
PQ: 9.7k, dropped by 25%

Now keep in mind that FIVE is an EP, so PQ dropped almost half from Ls debut week sales, and that's huge

And speaking of shallow, who isn't really? Even ayu is shallow enough to think that western people and everything about them is better than her own race, why do you think she used much more Caucasian actors in her PVs than Japanese? And why do you think that she loves the US so much that she almost moved there?

I agree completely. There are a ton more cultural taboos in Asia than there are in America, and a lot of them we can't understand. I don't really get the race thing because China and Japan may mock Americans but I've met a ton of Asians that would rather marry a white person than another Asian. I actually can't remember meeting a single Asian man or woman who didn't find white people at least slightly more attractive. But maybe that's my experience.

I think the divorce cost her a lot of support. She clearly rushed into that relationship, which looked really bad on her. And worse, it ended in a divorce, which looked even worse. She would have recovered better if she said amniotic fluid goes stale at 35 on national television instead of doing the shotgun marriage/shotgun divorce bit. And more, it looked like she was doing it for writing material after awhile. :|

I honestly can't disagree more with you about Ayumi praising whites. She is not a "race traitor" by any means. I would be quicker to call Koda that considering how many different men she's rubbed her cootch on in a music video, than I would ever call Ayu. I think Ayumi's main goal was to add a lot of diversity to her show. I honestly think that's where Manny and Timmy came in, along with Juno, and others. She's probably trying to show more unity among different people in her more recent music. The gay thing, while it irked me a little (even though I'm gay), I'm glad she did it because it, in a way, helped bring attention to something else very taboo in Asia: homosexuality. However, I'll never love what Ayu did more than what Elva Hsiao did in Let Love Fly... Elva made that video so ****ing awesomely beautiful and in good taste that I almost cry when I see it. It made me feel so good to be an Elva fan.

When Ayumi did it, I thought: Oh look, another sweaty shirtless gay guy dancing in a club. *next video*

Originally Posted by Bigtop

Taking a closer look at the top ten...

(she's in between Korean idol acts, if you're wondering)

No surprise that EXILE, YUI and Mr.Children outsold them (Mr.Children on their second week?). Even Yumi Matsutoya. Anyone shocked at the numbers or not?

She had her ass handed to her by BIGBANG. I'm completely ****ing shocked... dead serious.

[jewelbox]

Originally Posted by YuriChan

I think NEXT LEVEL is an amazing album! <3 But again, that's just me.

NEXT LEVEL is amazing!

I wouldn't be surprised if the Maro thing is actually one of the reasons for again's sales, idk.